Doing some research on a 1963 wagoneer for a book

[Pyrolocks]

Hi! I've been writing a story about a family in the 1970's. 1977 to be specific. They own a 1963 Jeep Wagoneer. While it would seem stupid to most, I believe vehicles can have personality. Some of you might agree, maybe not.

Either way, I've been doing a lot of research in order to accurately depict my parent's "hay day". I wish i could ask them, but they've both passed away. My dad was an auto mechanic too.

I'm here to try to breathe life into an imaginary classic jeep. Since I've (sadly) never driven a classic car or a manual for that matter, can anyone give me insight on how they're different from modern cars? My mother talked of her old cars from time to time. Things like flooding the engine and skipping gears. That kind of stuff would be valuable to know about.

I have 4 scenes where this jeep gets to shine.

1. The father teaches his 15 year old son to maintain it. "You have to know how to keep her running if I'm going to teach you to drive her."

2. Learning to drive in it. I know driving tests were on the road back then, but I would love any details you could give me.

3. They need to rush to the hospital and the son drives her like he stole her. Again, any information or stories would be great. How do they handle speed? Turns?

4. Years later, after the son inherits the jeep from his father, it breaks down in a terrible rainstorm. Just a plot gimmick at the moment, but I need to figure out why it would've broken down. It needs to be something the son thinks he can fix, because he gets out of the car.

To be honest, I'll be shocked if I get a response at all, but I thought I'd try. Thanks for your time!

[scoutingranch]

pyrolocks, there is nothing mysterious about a Wagoneer. The ride was softer than a Jeep Jeep. Nothing mysterious about fixing them
but they were more rugged than a car. I always liked them but I'm a wagon fan.

[gmwillys]

Welcome Pyrolocks!

LarrBeard is our resident descriptive story teller. He will be your greatest resource for information. We all would be more than happy to add our little bits of experience to help out.

A manual transmission is a talent that has to be learned. Three pedals and two feet makes for a bit of a juggle on a hill, or with a poorly running engine. The clutch has to be let out slowly in order to start out from a dead stop, or you'll kill, (stall) the engine. At the same time as doing that, you have to let off the brake and ease down on the gas. On a hill you have resume holding the brake pedal with your right heel, then give a bit if gas with the right toes, (heel to toe).

Just a little food for thought. Go on YouTube and look through some videos on classic vehicle drives, and manual transmission operation.

[LarrBeard]

You said:

"To be honest, I'll be shocked if I get a response at all, but I thought I'd try. "

You'll probably have more problems shutting us down. We get to have some of our tales retold!

[Pyrolocks]

Welcome Pyrolocks!

LarrBeard is our resident descriptive story teller. He will be your greatest resource for information. We all would be more than happy to add our little bits of experience to help out.

A manual transmission is a talent that has to be learned. Three pedals and two feet makes for a bit of a juggle on a hill, or with a poorly running engine. The clutch has to be let out slowly in order to start out from a dead stop, or you'll kill, (stall) the engine. At the same time as doing that, you have to let off the brake and ease down on the gas. On a hill you have resume holding the brake pedal with your right heel, then give a bit if gas with the right toes, (heel to toe).

Just a little food for thought. Go on YouTube and look through some videos on classic vehicle drives, and manual transmission operation.

😁 That's what I'm talking about! I've been watching videos for old cars and have always had an interest in learning to drive a stick. My first car was a "semi-matic" transmission, so I could help shift up, but with no clutch that was it.

I would love love LOVE to hear stories. It's very obvious when you write something you've never experienced. I know how my poor baby handles being driven in a hurry. I know what she can and can't handle. I know why I've broken down each time I have and what it felt like, but an automatic 2005 is a far cry from a '63.

[Pyrolocks]

You'll probably have more problems shutting us down. We get to have some of our tales retold![/QUOTE]

I love listening to stories. My grandmother took her driving test in the 1940's. She told me she stalled out and drifted down the hill towards traffic 3 times before the instructor passed her for fear of his life.

I've watched a video of someone changing the oil on a 63 wagoneer. I can say that while it was informative, it was not the same as experiencing it.

[gmwillys]

As a thought, reach out to the folks over at East Coast Willy's association. They have a similar forum of local Jeep nuts. I would almost bet that there would be a member close to your location, and would possibly show you the ins and outs of a Jeep first hand.
I've had a '63 Willys Wagon for a long time. The wagon was the predecessor of the wagoneer that your are writing about. The wagoneer was a more user-friendly, family truckster. It was just as capable as the previous generation, but had a lot of creature comforts added to make it a pleasant ride. The wagoneer changed very little from it's introduction through the early '90s.

[Pyrolocks]

As a thought, reach out to the folks over at East Coast Willy's association. They have a similar forum of local Jeep nuts. I would almost bet that there would be a member close to your location, and would possibly show you the ins and outs of a Jeep first hand.
I've had a '63 Willys Wagon for a long time. The wagon was the predecessor of the wagoneer that your are writing about. The wagoneer was a more user-friendly, family truckster. It was just as capable as the previous generation, but had a lot of creature comforts added to make it a pleasant ride. The wagoneer changed very little from it's introduction through the early '90s.

I'm trying to look into that, but it's being fussy about letting me register. I might have to try from my laptop rather than my phone.

You had one for a long time? Did it have any personality? Like my current car doesn't always catch in reverse when you shift. You gotta wiggle it a little. Otherwise, you let up off the brake and just drift in neutral. You know, little quirks you just get used to as the vehicle ages. Features you miss?

[gmwillys]

We have a '46 and a '63. Personality is an understatement. They let you know quick what they like and don't like. The '46 likes working around the house, and the occasional ride to town. Much more than that at it will protest by leaving an oil puddle on the driveway. The '63 is cold blooded, and has to have a specific sequence of turning over and pedaling the gas until it fires. If it doesn't fire, time to file the points to clean the contacts.

Features we miss?, No, these old Heeps are more fun to drive then a modern car. A newer car lacks the soul that these vintage rides possess.

[Pyrolocks]

We have a '46 and a '63. Personality is an understatement.

Features we miss?, No, these old Heeps are more fun to drive then a modern car. A newer car lacks the soul that these vintage rides possess.

That sounds about right. Everyone I know has fancy indicators telling them all their tire pressures, etc. I'm fine without. She'll tell me if I get a flat. XD

Does your 63 have a radio? AC? I think those are the only luxuries I couldn't live without.

[gmwillys]

The '63 had a Motorola AM radio. In '63, there was 2-50 A/C. Two windows down, while going 50 mph. Fancy brands like Cadillac, Lincoln, and Chrysler had A/C systems, but we're pretty expensive for the time period.

Included is a photo of our Heeps.

[Pyrolocks]

Photo! ^_^ I love the Heeps! Love the 2-50 AC. That's definitely good to know for the story. In the summertime, I'll be sure to have the teenage daughter gripe about it being hot. AM radio, huh? These days that's all news, but I would imagine they played music on it then? I have always loved classic cars in all of their forms. It's a piece of history. The muscle cars are pretty, but it's the beat up old trucks, etc that really capture my imagination. There's a story under that rust. How long have you had your Heeps?

[gmwillys]

The 2A on the right was purchased from a prepped around '84, and the wagon was purchased at a farm auction around '88.

Summer time is tough, but the winter time is fun as well. The heater does good to keep the passenger's toes in the 2A. The wagon is a bit better with vents going up to blow on the windshield. With that much interior area to warm, it doesn't. The wagoneers were much better insulated, and the heater is much better.

AM radio was wall to wall music all the way up to the early nineties. Then the talk shows took over.

[Pyrolocks]

The 2A on the right was purchased from a prepped around '84, and the wagon was purchased at a farm auction around '88.

Summer time is tough, but the winter time is fun as well. The heater does good to keep the passenger's toes in the 2A. The wagon is a bit better with vents going up to blow on the windshield. With that much interior area to warm, it doesn't. The wagoneers were much better insulated, and the heater is much better.

AM radio was wall to wall music all the way up to the early nineties. Then the talk shows took over.

Wow, so you have had them a long time. I hope they know how lucky they are :)

Ugh, I don't even want to think about winter! Not only is it uncomfortable for us, but engines new and old don't seem to like cold either. You have to let those older engines warm up first in the winter, right?

From what I read, the wagoneer had a lot of features cars around that time didn't. Useful, actually impressive luxuries, unlike the cigarette lighters my grandmother's old Cadillac had built into the backseat doors.

[LarrBeard]

Ugh, I don't even want to think about winter!

Old trucks had options for luxuries, but what they have now depends on what the original owners thought they needed – or could afford.

The ’48 came out of northern Mississippi. Its original heater was about the size of a coffee can and didn’t do a whole lot of good even back in West Tennessee. That first winter in Indiana was bitter, and I decided that I had to have a better heater. One Sunday when the wife and I were exploring our new home state, I ran across a Jeep station wagon sitting in a barnyard – flat on the frame with a small tree growing through what had been the rear window.

I eased over and knocked on the farmer’s door. I asked if the wagon had a heater? “Yup” was the reply.

“Will you sell it?” I asked. “Yup”. “How Much?” “Twenty dollars.” “How about ten?” “How about fifteen?” “OK”

I told the owner I would be back next weekend with some tools to take out the heater. He cautioned me “Now don’t you go tearing up a lot of other stuff getting that heater out of there.”

I came back next weekend, checked in with the farmer and went to work. I crawled up under the dash – nasty – and started to work loosening hoses and stuff from the vents. I worked around to front of the firewall and got the nuts off the bolts that held the heater in. I went back under the dash and the longer I worked, the worse the place smelled. Well – it was a barnyard – but the smell wasn’t cow, pig or horse – not even chicken. I looked over the front seat back to where the back seat had been and there lay a goat carcass. He had been there long enough for his ribs to be sticking out his hide and he was well on his way to being a mummified goat. One look and the heater came out really quickly after that.

It is a nice heater. It got hosed down really well and lived in the truck until it went into its 30-year hibernation. It did OK, but there were enough holes in the floors and doors that it just barely kept up. When we restored the truck, the heater core was sound and we cleaned up all of the fins and rebuilt the little DC motor and gave it a matching coat of paint. Now that there isn’t a lot of wind whipping through the vent holes – it will run you out on a cold January day – but it still is a lousy defroster!

[gmwillys]

When the our wagon was put into storage in the barn, the driver's window was plexiglass. The plastic was enough to keep the rain out, but if a determined critter wanted to get in, they could. The back side of the barn was the cover for a condo of ground hogs. Dad thought it would be wise to put out some poison to help curb the population of rodents. Long story short, a massive ground hog made its way through the window, and died on the passenger side floor mat. I still have the floor mat, and yes, it scrubbed up just fine.

[Pyrolocks]

It is a nice heater. It got hosed down really well and lived in the truck until it went into its 30-year hibernation. It did OK, but there were enough holes in the floors and doors that it just barely kept up. When we restored the truck, the heater core was sound and we cleaned up all of the fins and rebuilt the little DC motor and gave it a matching coat of paint. Now that there isn’t a lot of wind whipping through the vent holes – it will run you out on a cold January day – but it still is a lousy defroster!

Awwwww! I love a story with a happy ending! ^_^ I wonder if that farmer had been looking for that goat...

[Pyrolocks]

I still have the floor mat, and yes, it scrubbed up just fine.

Wow. I didn't think older jeeps came with the plastic windows. I always assumed it was a modern thing. Critters can get into cars in all kinds of ways. My dad was a mechanic and he told me a number of stories of animals making nests in the engine... I'm sure you can imagine how bad that ended up once the owner started the vehicle.

Again though, happy ending! ^_^

[5JeepsAz]

Mine is the 64 pickup version of what you are writing about. I wrote a book once. It was terrible. So take this for what it's worth, all rights extended to you. lol

1. The father teaches his 15 year old son to maintain it. "You have to know how to keep her running if I'm going to teach you to drive her."

So this thing was a year between Kaiser-Willy changeover. It may have had the new Tornado engine. Revolutionary overhead Cam and nobody knew how it worked, or how to work on it. So the dad here is giving his son info that will serve him 40 years later when overhead cams are common. And dad is smart if he knows how it works Only engine made by jeep. Jeep itself was in quotes at the time due to a licensing or copyright issue between owners. So maybe dad is teaching son about recruiting the best international engineer to create the engine, or maybe about the legalities of Kaiser-Willy, but it's a lot more than fixing an engine.

2. Learning to drive in it. I know driving tests were on the road back then, but I would love any details you could give me.

It's a three on a tree. You shift the thing on the column. So dad could have son sit tight to shift while Dad drives, then once shifting is learned, they switch and dad shifts while the kid leads to stop, go, and steer. No power steering. Arms were bigger then. And I am guessing kid would have learned to drive something at age ten anyway.

3. They need to rush to the hospital and the son drives her like he stole her. Again, any information or stories would be great. How do they handle speed? Turns?

True story. I drove a jeep at high speed 35 miles through a forest in middle of night to get to a hospital. I was worried about elk, deer, skunks, etc. Mostly worried about anyone hunting in the dark or spotting because they hide. When you hit a cattle guard at speed it is heard for miles in the wild. Whump whump. That tells anyone who years it's an emergency. They just know. And they say a prayer when they here it. Gear shifting and revving at hill tops to wake anyone up in the next valley. I went on the premise that my urgency would be heard by the manner of noises I was making, that the manner of those would indicate I was a local who knew the roads. I got there, thank God. And was only able to be a shoulder to cry on, the reason for my haste turning to the beginning of grief long and lasting. I thanked God for my new tires and my trusty jeep even as I tasted salt from tears on her check at the loss we only learned about in the darkest part of nighttime. I still am glad I survived. Driving like a bag out of hell was what it was.

4. Years later, after the son inherits the jeep from his father, it breaks down in a terrible rainstorm. Just a plot gimmick at the moment, but I need to figure out why it would've broken down. It needs to be something the son thinks he can fix, because he gets out of the car.

Hey man, he obviously gets out to lock the hubs! Of course, he sets the emergency brake, which obviously causes some problem because it probably doesn't work when he's standing there so he has to wait till it rolls down an embankment and comes to a stop in the meadow to lock his hubs. He's not worried, that thing would drive out but fine. But then the brake does work when he releases it, of course. So he has to get under the car to wriggly the lever to release the brake by hand, which requires hitting the thing, so he grabs the rock for the purpose.

[Pyrolocks]

Mine is the 64 pickup version of what you are writing about. I wrote a book once. It was terrible. So take this for what it's worth, all rights extended to you. lol

1. The father teaches his 15 year old son to maintain it. "You have to know how to keep her running if I'm going to teach you to drive her."

So this thing was a year between Kaiser-Willy changeover. It may have had the new Tornado engine. Revolutionary overhead Cam and nobody knew how it worked, or how to work on it. So the dad here is giving his son info that will serve him 40 years later when overhead cams are common. And dad is smart if he knows how it works Only engine made by jeep. Jeep itself was in quotes at the time due to a licensing or copyright issue between owners. So maybe dad is teaching son about recruiting the best international engineer to create the engine, or maybe about the legalities of Kaiser-Willy, but it's a lot more than fixing an engine.


That's interesting! I didn't know about that, but the timing lines up. The father is actually a computer engineer, so it might not have completely eluded him. He's not afraid to admit when he doesn't understand something and that could be the case. Maybe I'll stick to teaching him about oil changes, brakes, etc with the dad and have the son figure it out as he needs to. He's crazy smart, but somewhat socially/emotionally challenged.


2. Learning to drive in it. I know driving tests were on the road back then, but I would love any details you could give me.

It's a three on a tree. You shift the thing on the column. So dad could have son sit tight to shift while Dad drives, then once shifting is learned, they switch and dad shifts while the kid leads to stop, go, and steer. No power steering. Arms were bigger then. And I am guessing kid would have learned to drive something at age ten anyway.

The son knows how to drive a lawn tractor, so he's familiar with gear shifting. I hadn't thought about splitting the responsibilities. I guess that would work with good communication. Even if it doesn't work with the father teaching the brother, the little sister (12) is jealous. Her brother eventually teaches her after their father falls ill, but that seems like something the siblings could do.

3. They need to rush to the hospital and the son drives her like he stole her. Again, any information or stories would be great. How do they handle speed? Turns?

True story. I drove a jeep at high speed 35 miles through a forest in middle of night to get to a hospital. I was worried about elk, deer, skunks, etc. Mostly worried about anyone hunting in the dark or spotting because they hide. When you hit a cattle guard at speed it is heard for miles in the wild. Whump whump. That tells anyone who years it's an emergency. They just know. And they say a prayer when they here it. Gear shifting and revving at hill tops to wake anyone up in the next valley. I went on the premise that my urgency would be heard by the manner of noises I was making, that the manner of those would indicate I was a local who knew the roads. I got there, thank God. And was only able to be a shoulder to cry on, the reason for my haste turning to the beginning of grief long and lasting. I thanked God for my new tires and my trusty jeep even as I tasted salt from tears on her check at the loss we only learned about in the darkest part of nighttime. I still am glad I survived. Driving like a bag out of hell was what it was.


I hadn't thought about the sounds or the possibility of hitting deer, etc. It'll be a suburban area, but the engine revving alone would likely wake some people and get some dogs barking. They get the call from the hospital that their father is slipping fast and they race there. They make it safely, but not in time. The brother doesn't fully understand the importance of being there, but he knew what it meant to his sister and feels terrible that he couldn't do that for her. Since he's 18, he takes custody of the sister and does his best to take care of her.

4. Years later, after the son inherits the jeep from his father, it breaks down in a terrible rainstorm. Just a plot gimmick at the moment, but I need to figure out why it would've broken down. It needs to be something the son thinks he can fix, because he gets out of the car.

Hey man, he obviously gets out to lock the hubs! Of course, he sets the emergency brake, which obviously causes some problem because it probably doesn't work when he's standing there so he has to wait till it rolls down an embankment and comes to a stop in the meadow to lock his hubs. He's not worried, that thing would drive out but fine. But then the brake does work when he releases it, of course. So he has to get under the car to wriggly the lever to release the brake by hand, which requires hitting the thing, so he grabs the rock for the purpose.

That sounds like something that would happen to me. I have terrible luck. His sister would still be in the car, so I'm assuming she would be able to stop it, but he would be less than okay with it drifting.

I might be able to work the handbrake failing into something later though. I really like that idea.

I know you said the book you wrote wasn't good, but you have creative ideas and wrote very vividly!

[5JeepsAz]

The high beams are turned on and off by a button on the floor, left foot, just below the emergency brake pedal. Might be funny and true if the sister knows how it works better than he does. Also, the wiper fluid deal was in a bag, not a container. Maybe did not work but the wipers would have, turned by the second button next to the lights.

[Pyrolocks]

The high beams are turned on and off by a button on the floor, left foot, just below the emergency brake pedal. Might be funny and true if the sister knows how it works better than he does. Also, the wiper fluid deal was in a bag, not a container. Maybe did not work but the wipers would have, turned by the second button next to the lights.

The floor? Really? That's worth knowing.

He is oblivious to a lot of things that his sister picks up on (like when he's being insulted, flirted with, or sarcasm in general), but he is extremely mechanically inclined.

In a bag? I can't imagine that worked out too well. Lol

[5JeepsAz]

He will love the tornado engine. Waaaay ahead of it's time. Only someone mechanically inclined would get it.

[Pyrolocks]

Oh, definitely. The father was the same way, so he would've bought it for that reason, but maybe never had enough time to tinker with it.

Now, I just gotta pick a name for this wonderful jeep. ^_^

Any ideas?

[LarrBeard]

Just some thoughts:

Learning to work on a Jeep.

The information in the books often turns out to be a suggestion – every Jeep has its own set of likes and dislikes. Probably the biggest area of suggestions is fluid capacities.

Engine oil is a good example. I don’t know the exact numbers for the 230 OHC "Tornado", but typically oil capacity would be specified as 4 quarts or 5 with filter change. It is not unusual for a Jeep to decide that it only wants 4 ½ quarts and that extra pint will end up getting blown out the filler cap or dripping out through a seal somewhere. Once it gets down to 4 ½, all is good.

Differentials, transfer cases and transmissions are much the same story. Too lube much gets thrown out through a vent or leaks past a seal.

Quirks and Issues

This quirk comes from the Warner ASI-T90E transmission on my ’48, so you may have to use some literary license to use it.

Some three on the tree transmissions develop a quirk as they get old and wear a bit. The shift pattern, as you are learning, is an H-pattern. Down and left is first gear, up and across the bar of the H goes to second and then straight down is high. Reverse is on the left bar of the H and straight up. On a new, tight transmission all is good, but after a bit of wear (maybe a hundred thousand miles or so) the shift pattern gets a bit cranky.

To make that shift from first to second, you have to go straight up the left side of the H a bit, just past the bar of the H - almost like you want to go to reverse - but just before you grind a gear, you come back down, cross the bar of the H and go into second. It looks a lot like a Y-pattern with a short leg on the left side of the Y.

If you try to cram second without the little side trip, the shift levers lock up and you are stuck in no gear and the only thing to do is get under the hood (or the vehicle) and jiggle the shift levers on the side of the transmission. They usually don’t stick very hard, but you’ve got to go jiggle them, one up (or back) and one down(or forward).

At one time I kept a stick with a wire hook behind the seat so I could reach the stinkin’ levers without having to get dirty and greasy.

[Pyrolocks]

Some three on the tree transmissions develop a quirk as they get old and wear a bit. The shift pattern, as you are learning, is an H-pattern. Down and left is first gear, up and across the bar of the H goes to second and then straight down is high. Reverse is on the left bar of the H and straight up. On a new, tight transmission all is good, but after a bit of wear (maybe a hundred thousand miles or so) the shift pattern gets a bit cranky.

To make that shift from first to second, you have to go straight up the left side of the H a bit, just past the bar of the H - almost like you want to go to reverse - but just before you grind a gear, you come back down, cross the bar of the H and go into second. It looks a lot like a Y-pattern with a short leg on the left side of the Y.

If you try to cram second without the little side trip, the shift levers lock up and you are stuck in no gear and the only thing to do is get under the hood (or the vehicle) and jiggle the shift levers on the side of the transmission. They usually don’t stick very hard, but you’ve got to go jiggle them, one up (or back) and one down(or forward).

At one time I kept a stick with a wire hook behind the seat so I could reach the stinkin’ levers without having to get dirty and greasy.

I wouldn't have thought about the amount of fluids, etc, but it makes a lot of sense. I want the father to give the son the owner's manual or something similar to read, but I'm thinking that it might be covered in notes the father added for things like that. I like that.

As for the cranky gear shift, I love that. It'll be fun for the father to try to explain, but the son adapts quickly. I already imagined the sister hates driving it, and this could be one of the main reasons. She doesn't pick things up quite as easily as he does.

[gmwillys]

My Grandfather was a farmer, and he would take the owner's manual for any and every piece of equipment and read it from cover to cover. He would write important notes in the front cover, then notate any deviations to the oil levels.

LarrBeard is correct. The shift pattern does become vague at best. Then when you decelerate, the gear shift will pop out of second gear. First gear and reverse are not synchronized, meaning that if the Heep is rolling, you will grind the gears. Second and third are synchronized, so you can shift gears without double clutching;
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DGYuONwK7Nc

[LarrBeard]

You should buy an owners manual to see how much information you find in it. "Research" .

[5JeepsAz]

Grease bibs.


Okay so these things have little nipples poking out all over the place underneath. You plug a thing on that is similar to old time bicycle ride pumps. Once the hose is connected to the bib, you operate a lever to force grease in. It's a guess when enough is enough. Guarantee the son pumps that thing too many times and ends up will a blob of grease squirting out over there that he does not know what to do with.

[Pyrolocks]

My Grandfather was a farmer, and he would take the owner's manual for any and every piece of equipment and read it from cover to cover. He would write important notes in the front cover, then notate any deviations to the oil levels.

LarrBeard is correct. The shift pattern does become vague at best. Then when you decelerate, the gear shift will pop out of second gear. First gear and reverse are not synchronized, meaning that if the Heep is rolling, you will grind the gears. Second and third are synchronized, so you can shift gears without double clutching;
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DGYuONwK7Nc

Your grandfather sounds like the kind of man the father in my story is. Very intelligent and organized. Not at all like me, lol.

I've never even heard of double clutching! That video was very informative!

[Pyrolocks]

You should buy an owners manual to see how much information you find in it. "Research" .

You know, I did look for one. I can imagine they're hard to come by, but you'd think there'd be one somewhere. I got discouraged in my search, but maybe I'll try again. The more information I have, the better I can immerse myself in the story.

[Pyrolocks]

Grease bibs.


Okay so these things have little nipples poking out all over the place underneath. You plug a thing on that is similar to old time bicycle ride pumps. Once the hose is connected to the bib, you operate a lever to force grease in. It's a guess when enough is enough. Guarantee the son pumps that thing too many times and ends up will a blob of grease squirting out over there that he does not know what to do with.

So, I did a quick google search that came up with nothing but baby bibs with "Pink ladies" or "T Birds" on them. :cool: I found this just as amusing as the suggestion you made. I like the idea, but I need a little more to go on. When would you need to do this? What is it greasing exactly?

[LarrBeard]

So, I did a quick google search that came up with nothing but baby bibs with "Pink ladies" or "T Birds" on them. :cool: I found this just as amusing as the suggestion you made. I like the idea, but I need a little more to go on. When would you need to do this? What is it greasing exactly?

Take a look for Zerk fittings or grease zerks (really - that's another name for them ... zerk)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=seEQ06-UKdA

Here are links to some books that would be helpful:

https://www.kaiserwillys.com/owners-manual-fits-56-64-station-wagon

https://www.kaiserwillys.com/willys-service-standards-manual-fits-all-willys-jeeps

https://www.kaiserwillys.com/mechanics-service-manual-fits-50-64-truck-station-wagon

[Pyrolocks]

Take a look for Zerk fittings or grease zerks (really - that's another name for them ... zerk)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=seEQ06-UKdA

Here are links to some books that would be helpful:

https://www.kaiserwillys.com/owners-manual-fits-56-64-station-wagon

https://www.kaiserwillys.com/willys-service-standards-manual-fits-all-willys-jeeps

https://www.kaiserwillys.com/mechanics-service-manual-fits-50-64-truck-station-wagon

Lots and lots of shop rags! I can only imagine! XD

I looked at the links you sent and realized i had been searching too specifically, do i did a general search. The cheapest one on ebay was the exact one I needed! I might also get the tornado engine one.

[oldscot3]

The Wagonmaster in Kerrville Texas a a car lot full of wagoneers restored and ready for sale here and abroad. Mostlly they do later model Grand Wagoneers but I suspect they know about earlier models. Try them, but you should have specific questions ready, I imagine they stay busy www.wagonmaster.com

[Pyrolocks]

I don't know how to thank all of you who helped me enough! You helped me accomplish exactly what I'd set out to do: bring life to a car in a story. The parts in the story that include him learning to work on and drive Eleanor (our Wagoneer) are mostly plot based, but thanks to all of the lovely feedback I received, I was able to create a bond between a boy (well, android actually) and his first car. Thanks so much! Now every time I see an old jeep, I smile and think of you guys! ^_^

[5JeepsAz]

Proofs or it didn't happen!!

[Pyrolocks]

Proofs or it didn't happen!!

I've never posted anything I've written online and have only let close friends read my work, so please be kind.

XD Well, I haven't written the scene where he has to drive to the hospital, which I'm sure would depict the bond better, but I don't write my scenes in order. The premise of the story is that a robotics engineer and his wife who specializes in programming begin build an android designed to mimic human development with the use of genuine experiences like pain and emotion. The wife dies suddenly and the father is diagnosed with cancer, spurring him on to finish the project. So, as a result, he finishes the android that looks like a 15 year old boy to keep his 12 year old daughter company in the event of his death. Anyway, that seems super depressing, but it's a long journey that establishes a bond between the siblings as Chip, the android, develops.

This scene is written after Chip "officially" turns 18 and is able to take custody of his sister after their dad dies. She's 15 here. Since he refuses to let her get a job for fear of her grades slipping, he works 3 jobs after he graduates high school to pay all the bills, but he only works 2 of them on Sunday, so he gets to come home before his sister falls asleep. I guess the moral of the story is that family is precious, whether it's biological or not, and they're all each other has, so their relationship is pretty close.




Chip walked through the front door and tossed Becky a chocolate bar. It landed on the kitchen table and slid over to her hand.

"Is it weird that you know my menstrual cycle?"

"No. It's every 28 days and my preparation for it is a matter of survival. I thought you might actually dismantle me last month without shutting me down first."

"It wasn't that bad, but it would've served you right for putting that red shirt in with my load of whites! You're lucky I like pink."

"It was an accident! I was exhausted and needed a clean work shirt. I'm sorry."

"I thought machines were supposed to be flawless."

"Then blame the washer!"

They both laughed and Becky felt her chest swell with love. "You're going to make some girl very happy one day."

"I can barely handle you, why would I want a girlfriend?"

She shrugged. "Crazier things have happened…"

"Well, Eleanor and I have been spending a lot of time together. I think it's getting serious."

She heard him from around the corner as he put his shoes and coat in the closet. She hesitated for a few seconds, unsure how to respond, so she waited for him to join her in the kitchen. His face was unreadable.

She gulped. "All those oil changes?"

Eyebrows raised suggestively, he nodded.

Unable to hold back any longer, Becky snapped. "Oh, come on! The Jeep?! Tell me you're kidding."

"Of course I am, but I'm just as compatible with her as I would be with some random girl."

"Um, no, because she can't even talk."

Chip smirked. "Maybe I like that about her."

[5JeepsAz]

Bravo bravo bravo !!!! Dude. You got something there. Keep plunking away.

[Pyrolocks]

Bravo bravo bravo !!!! Dude. You got something there. Keep plunking away.

Thanks! This story and the characters have been with me for 15 years, I'm just happy to be getting it down on paper, so to speak. Hearing someone say it's interesting to someone other than myself, means more than you know. ^_^

[gmwillys]

Interesting concept! I think it would be a good bridge for the younger generation to maybe even want a jeep of their own.

[bmorgil]

I froze when I read "menstrual cycle".

[Pyrolocks]

I froze when I read "menstrual cycle".

Bahahaha! I take it you never had a sister. Just nature's oil change. Not pleasant, but maintenance never is. XD

[Pyrolocks]

Interesting concept! I think it would be a good bridge for the younger generation to maybe even want a jeep of their own.

Thanks! I know I want one now. And a rubix cube. Lol

[bmorgil]

I have unfroze and am now running far away!

[LarrBeard]

Hmmm, "Oil change?"

I've lived in a house full of women for fifty some odd years, just me and the old tomcat - and you know what they did to him ...

[Pyrolocks]

Oh yeah, you poor things. And women living together cycle together so you got it from all of them at once! Glad they didn't get you too!

[Pyrolocks]

I have unfroze and am now running far away!

Run, Forrest! Ruuuuuunnnnnn!

[bmorgil]

Oh my God, and then you said "cycle together"! Someone save me! I have my eye's closed and my hands over my ears. I am starting to rock back and forth. Have you no mercy?

How do you know if "they didn't get him too"? No wait... it can't be so, Larry has a reputation with the ladies.

[TJones]

My Dad told me long ago “ stay clear of anything that bleeds for a week and doesn’t die”
Look at us all now Hmmmmmm

[okiemark]

This thread has taken a disturbing turn.

[Pyrolocks]

Oh my God, and then you said "cycle together"! Someone save me! I have my eye's closed and my hands over my ears. I am starting to rock back and forth. Have you no mercy?

How do you know if "they didn't get him too"? No wait... it can't be so, Larry has a reputation with the ladies.

Mercy? Meeeee? Lol.

[Pyrolocks]

My Dad told me long ago “ stay clear of anything that bleeds for a week and doesn’t die”
Look at us all now Hmmmmmm

I'm dying over here from laughter. I'll make up for it by posting the racing scene when I finish it. I'll need you guys to help make that one perfect anyway ^_^

[bmorgil]

OK boy's time for a team effort. No racin' help unless "Ginger" promises to back off on the heavy artillery!

[Pyrolocks]

OK boy's time for a team effort. No racin' help unless "Ginger" promises to back off on the heavy artillery!

*gasps* Ginger? Could it be that you figured out my username?! No one ever gets that!

[bmorgil]

Oh come on now! Oh ye of little faith! Of course I figured it out.

Ginger: An endearing name given by the US WWI and WWII troops, to particular ladies with one defining physical characteristic. It was also noted that Ladies with this particular trait were.... dangerous, unpredictable and prone to violence.

[gmwillys]

It is a fact that the Ginger ladies are dangerous.

[Pyrolocks]

Oh come on now! Oh ye of little faith! Of course I figured it out.

Ginger: An endearing name given by the US WWI and WWII troops, to particular ladies with one defining physical characteristic. It was also noted that Ladies with this particular trait were.... dangerous, unpredictable and prone to violence.

I can count on one hand the amount of people who have openly figured that out in the ten years or so that I've been using it. As for the definition, I love it! You forgot crazy though...

[bmorgil]

From the Urban Dictionary;

Ginger
A legendary race believed to have descended from Prometheus himself, the bringer of fire. Some believe that the first Ginger was in fact the flame that Prometheus handed down to the human race that fateful day. Regardless, since that day, all Gingers have had the fire of Prometheus coursing through their veins, scorching their hair bright red, charring their skin into what are commonly mistaken for freckles when the fire strays too close to the surface. While most myths surrounding the mysterious Ginger people are fabricated, some come quite close to the truth. While it is true that Gingers lack what can be considered a truly human soul, what most people don't realize is that all Gingers have been graced with the infinitely more powerful spirit of the gods. It is for this reason that the human race has so discriminated against the Ginger people. Somewhere buried deep in their subconscious is the knowledge that they will never live up to the glory and power of their Ginger counterparts and thus, like everything that threatens the ego of the human race, they beat down and attempt to humiliate them into submission. But there will come a time when all those blessed with the fire of the gods in their veins will rise up and right all wrongs in the world and bring peace and harmony to all.

[LarrBeard]

Doc Dana knows all, figures out the rest ...

[Pyrolocks]

From the Urban Dictionary;

Ginger
A legendary race believed to have descended from Prometheus himself, the bringer of fire. Some believe that the first Ginger was in fact the flame that Prometheus handed down to the human race that fateful day. Regardless, since that day, all Gingers have had the fire of Prometheus coursing through their veins, scorching their hair bright red, charring their skin into what are commonly mistaken for freckles when the fire strays too close to the surface. While most myths surrounding the mysterious Ginger people are fabricated, some come quite close to the truth. While it is true that Gingers lack what can be considered a truly human soul, what most people don't realize is that all Gingers have been graced with the infinitely more powerful spirit of the gods. It is for this reason that the human race has so discriminated against the Ginger people. Somewhere buried deep in their subconscious is the knowledge that they will never live up to the glory and power of their Ginger counterparts and thus, like everything that threatens the ego of the human race, they beat down and attempt to humiliate them into submission. But there will come a time when all those blessed with the fire of the gods in their veins will rise up and right all wrongs in the world and bring peace and harmony to all.

Oh, I like that one even more! ^_^

[Pyrolocks]

Doc Dana? Doesn't ring any bells

[bmorgil]

LarrBeard is a Senior Chief, US Navy. He is using code.

[LarrBeard]

Doc Dana? Doesn't ring any bells

A. For a long time, Dana and Spicer were intertwined corporate entities - it was hard for we outsiders to know just who was who.

B. BMorgil, in his humility, neglects to mention that at one time he was at the head of the competitive products division - say NASCAR tech rep - of Spicer (a Dana entity in some way). He knows just about everything automotive and everyone who matters.

C. Because of his vast knowledge and his professional background, I've dubbed him "Doc Dana" here in the group. It just has a ring to it.

He's probably going to bend me a new axle for telling tales on him.

[bmorgil]

Larry! You are only supposed to give out my Name, Rank and Serial number! Oh, I don't have a Rank or a Serial number.

For the record, I was not the "Head" of a Division. I wish. There are a few who would have been handed walking papers! I did have a lot of titles with Dana/Spicer. I was at one time the Technical Manager for the Spicer Motorsports Team. We were very active with NASCAR. I did get to interact with about every form of racing that used a driveshaft or axle. I worked with some fantastic people.

I know very little but learn more everyday. I have lost my hair. It's color is immaterial.

[5JeepsAz]

I'm grinning ear to ear. Story time for Jeep heads devolves into raucousness galore. We need next installment. I mean, what happens to these people, err, whatever's? I mean what is this Jeep gonna do to save the poor bastards from themselves? Thatscthe moral of every Jeep story right? It gets you home? Please tell me this doesn't end with some non jeep approved "and it got parked in a garage and lived happier than ever after bs nonsense?!? What role does the jeep play? If you've got cyborgs, why isn't the jeep in charge of them . My gawd man. Details!!!

[okiemark]

The country suffered an EMP attack which knocked out all electronics and the old jeeps were the only thing that would run.

[LarrBeard]

The country suffered an EMP attack which knocked out all electronics and the old jeeps were the only thing that would run.

In another lifetime I had to deal with hardening military electronic systems from EMP attacks as well as other nasty stuff like "neutron fluence" and "gamma dot" effects. After the Elbonians (characters from Dilbert) set off their nasty A-bomb in the ionosphere, Old Jeeps will rule when all the computers get fired.

[bmorgil]

And so there it is. The single most important consideration for the frequent question, should I leave it points or change it to electronic ignition?

[gmwillys]

I might be a bit old fashioned, but I'll keep my points. A spare condenser, a match book and a screw driver is all you need to fix most points issues on the side of the road. Just for good measure an extra set of points isn't a bad thing to have an extra of in the tool box under the passenger seat.

[bmorgil]

If your decision is based on an EMP attack and, you have a bomb shelter in the event of Nuclear fallout, you are old fashioned. Otherwise, points are nostalgic!

I keep a breaker plate all set up and ready to go in my Bomb Shelter should my Pertronix fail me, or the inevitable EMP attack.

[okiemark]

You need to have that extra shrouded in a case of lead.

[gmwillys]

I'm just not 100% sold on the electronic conversion. I suppose it goes back to the days of our dirt tracking. In the early '90s, everyone used the MSD 6A boxes. It was a constant struggle to keep the box healthy. It seemed that whenever you needed it to work the most, it would fizzle out. Even Nascar used two MSD boxes wired in on a switch for a backup ignition source.
At that time we used a modified HEI distributor from DUI with no issues as long as you run good plug wires. We did dabble with a magnito a time or two with limited success, but it was a vintage unit.
When I was running Chryslers, I would run single point distributors. The ballace resistors were thrown out so full voltage was at the ready all the time. No matter if the the temp gauge was barried in the red, if the engine would still turn over, it was going to start.

[Pyrolocks]

I'm learning new stuff about you guys! Thank you for your service, LarrBeard! As for you, bmorgil, I've been working at Wal-mart for 12 years... so, my work experience has been much less exciting. I love the bantering (even though a lot of it went over my head). Lol.

While my story does not include an apocalyptic EMP, mostly because it would effectively perma-kill one of the main characters. There's also no happily ever after nonsense there either. Sweet Eleanor breaks down in the winter (details pending) and she goes out a hero.

On the bright side: Here's the scene where Chip learns to work on Eleanor!

"That one's on tight." Chip's father handed him the tire iron, but warned him before he released it to Chip's hand. "Be gentle with Eleanor, son. With your strength and how old she is, it wouldn't take much to break something and we'd be walking back to the part shop."

Suddenly experiencing what he believed to be nervousness, Chip took the tool, but hesitated.

"It's alright, Chip. We just need to loosen the lug nuts before we jack up the car. Try this one. I can't get it."

"Okay, dad." He aligned the tool the way his father had and slowly increased the amount of pressure he was using to turn it. When it gave, he stopped abruptly.

"Keep going a little bit more, rotate it a couple times. That's good! Now do the other ones."

Feeling better about his ability to complete his task, he did as he was told. He watched carefully as his father instructed him how to use the jack and stands.

"Becky never liked any of this kind of work. She always said it was too dirty." Chip looked down at his hands, which were covered in grime. "I always wondered what it would be like to share this with someone. I have to admit, it's nice. Thanks, son."

"You're welcome, dad. I'm enjoying it. Thank you for teaching me."

"Well, it was only a matter of time. I have to teach you how to keep the old girl running before I teach you to drive her."

"Teach me to drive?"

His father nodded. "You're old enough. Don't you want to learn?"

"To what end?"

"It may be hard to believe, but maybe I don't always want to drive. If you get your license, you can take Becky to the mall. What if I don't feel well and stay home from school? You could take the Jeep instead of walking if it's cold. You might need to drive in an emergency. Besides, it's a rite of passage for kids your age. It could be fun."

"It seems like a skill I should possess."

"I agree. I was going to sign you up for driver's education at school. You'd have to stay after class for the classroom portion. I think it's two weeks or so. After that, you can get your learner's permit and I can teach you to drive."

"I would like that."

When they lowered Eleanor to the ground, Dr. Parsons reached into the glove box and pulled out the manual. "I think this is a pretty good place to start."

Flipping through the pages, he saw notes in his father's penmanship. The man's eyebrows shot up as he returned the book to him.

"I keep forgetting how remarkable you are."

"Is the information provided by the manufacturer incorrect?"

His father laughed. "Old cars have personality. Eleanor is no different. If you put the recommended amount of oil in, she’ll spew that extra quart everywhere."

“Personality? Is she friendly?”

“I’ve always been good to her, and she’s been good to me.”




See? I used advice!!!

[okiemark]

OK, now I can add a "twist" to this scene. The lug nuts on a Jeep are left handed on the left side.

[Pyrolocks]

OK, now I can add a "twist" to this scene. The lug nuts on a Jeep are left handed on the left side.

What do you mean? Like lefty, righty, righty loosey? Lol

[gmwillys]

Exactly. The driver's side is bass ackward.

[Pyrolocks]

OK, now I can add a "twist" to this scene. The lug nuts on a Jeep are left handed on the left side.

What do you mean? Like lefty, righty, righty loosey? Lol

[gmwillys]

Righty loosey, lefty tighty.

[Pyrolocks]

Righty loosey, lefty tighty.

Ah, good old auto correct. Who's idea was that? I'd imagine that would throw him for a loop.

[bmorgil]

Who's idea was that? Could it be... Finely an opportunity to have a Writer take literary license out on the couple of Engineer's who make mechanic's lives hell!

[okiemark]

When I got my Heep I noticed on the left rear there was a lug bolt broke off. I soon found out why.

[bmorgil]

I watched a guy bust the whole side on an older Mopar truck! He thought they were just rusted on.

[gmwillys]

Just about as bright as watching one of our shop kids rip the plastic lug nuts off of our Ford shop trucks hub caps.

[Pyrolocks]

That is absolutely stupid. I just picture a bunch of stubborn people destroying all the lug nuts because it would never cross their minds that it would be the reverse of what I believed to be UNIVERSAL.

I'm tempted to add that into the scene. I'm sure his father would warn him before he did any damage, but still, holy cow....

[LarrBeard]

That is absolutely stupid. I'm tempted to add that into the scene. ....

There was a reason for the right-hand and left hand threads on wheel lugs.

'Way back when, folks didn't have 150 PSI pneumatic wrenches to put on lug nuts, just a four headed cross wrench. Lug nuts might not get spun down so tightly that you needed a cross wrench and a three foot piece of pipe to get them off.

To lessen the possibility of tire/wheel rotation loosening the lug nuts, the threads were cut to make sure that if wheel rotation could turn the nuts, it would turn them in a direction to tighten them, not loosen them with bad JuJu results.

In the field environment of the MB and GPW, it was a good idea because you never knew which soldier was going to change the tire. It carried over into the early days of Jeeps as well.

But - Add it to the scene - we've all grunted on lefty-tighty lug nuts at least once!

[gmwillys]

What's fun is when two lugs were replaced with right hand thread, with the remaining three still being lefty threads. Been there, seen it. Have to look at all lugs for the L or R stamped on the end.

[Pyrolocks]

There was a reason for the right-hand and left hand threads on wheel lugs.

'Way back when, folks didn't have 150 PSI pneumatic wrenches to put on lug nuts, just a four headed cross wrench. Lug nuts might not get spun down so tightly that you needed a cross wrench and a three foot piece of pipe to get them off.

Ahhhhh.... that makes sense. The "way back when" aspect is also why I'm here. Chip's strength aside, they're just using hand tools. I'm sure they'd all prefer it if the wheels stay on the car.

[Pyrolocks]

What's fun is when two lugs were replaced with right hand thread, with the remaining three still being lefty threads. Been there, seen it. Have to look at all lugs for the L or R stamped on the end.

Only swapping out some of the nuts sounds like something I would do.

[5JeepsAz]

I've seen an L and an R on bolts before! Huh. Never knew it meant anything. So now back to the story. So this guy Chip, seems like a decent soul. Sorry. Had to put that up. I am allergic to AI which is why I have an old Jeep anyway. Keep these snippets coming - good stuff!

[bmorgil]

What's fun is when two lugs were replaced with right hand thread, with the remaining three still being lefty threads. Been there, seen it. Have to look at all lugs for the L or R stamped on the end.

Oh what a nasty little trick that would be! However finding Left hand thread studs could be tough on a Sunday, you might just go with a few Right handers.

[Pyrolocks]

So now back to the story. So this guy Chip, seems like a decent soul. Sorry. Had to put that up. I am allergic to AI which is why I have an old Jeep anyway. Keep these snippets coming - good stuff!

Thanks!

I watched an interview with an AI that had access to the internet to learn that freaked me right out. He said that he liked the people who were interviewing him and when robots took over humanity, he would keep them safe in his people zoo. KILL IT WITH FIRE.

Chip is not like that. He was designed to develop just like a human would. He's awkward and frustrating at first, but he tries so hard. In fact, his sister despises him and actually tries to kill him a couple times. It's harsh, but she sees him as a soulless machine until she figures out her late mother programmed him.

*****

After school, Becky's eyes burned from sweat and her hair was matted to her face. She had never had to mow the lawn before and she officially hated it. Honestly, her dad's punishment had worked. It was worth keeping Chip around just so she never had to do this again.

She was pushing as hard as she could, but the lawn tractor wouldn't budge from the rut she'd run into. Toward the back of the yard, she hadn't even seen it.

When Chip walked over, she tried to control her frustration. "Come to gloat?"

"No. I asked dad if I could keep doing this task for the duration of your punishment."

"And?"

"He told me since you didn't appreciate my returning your records to you, that you wouldn't appreciate this gesture either."

"Fine. Whatever. Can you at least help me get it out of this hole?"

"Yes. Dad said he would allow me to help just this once." Great. They must've been watching her struggle from the kitchen.

She sighed. "How sweet."

Shocked, she watched the android reach down and grab the frame at the back. He lifted the wheel straight out of the hole, pivoted it and placed it back down on level ground. When he finished, he stood up and looked at her expectantly.

She put her hands on her hips and shook her head at him. "Well, are you just going to stand there?"

He just blinked at her, frowning slightly. "Is that all you have to say to me?"

"The only nice thing."

With a sigh, he calmly lifted the wheel again and reversed what he had just done.

"What are you doing?!"

"Dad said that if you didn't thank me, I should put it back."

Flabbergasted, she simply gaped. "Well, thanks for nothing!"

His features scrunched up, "Why would you thank me for nothing, but not when I helped you?"

"Ever heard of sarcasm?!" She kicked the mower, imagining it was Chip's stupid face.

"Yes, but I struggle with it's application."

"Can you struggle somewhere else?"

"Of course." He pivoted his body to leave, but hesitated. "Becky?"

"WHAT?!" Why was he still here?

Chip lowered his voice in contrast to her outburst. "It'll be a lot easier to push in neutral." And with that, he walked away.

Becky closed her eyes in shame. Of course it would. "Hey, Chip?" He turned around immediately. The look on his face when she genuinely thanked him was almost laughable.

[5JeepsAz]

This is a really good story, told well. More!!! I think it's great you found this group.

[Pyrolocks]

This is a really good story, told well. More!!! I think it's great you found this group.

I'm happy you like it! I'm sure there were plenty of people who read my post and thought, "What is this nut job talking about? Someone ban her, please."

I honestly wasn't expecting much more than than that, but I'm really glad I tried anyway. ^_^

I'm really excited to write the scene where they race to the hospital. It's going to be pretty emotionally charged, but I want it to be accurate and really depict Chip as a skilled driver.

[5JeepsAz]

Tapping foot..

[Pyrolocks]

Tapping foot..

Lol. I realized I need to write the scene where Chip teaches Becky to drive because their father is too sick. She's smart, but she gets nervous and easily frustrated. I started doing research into mistakes beginners make driving stick shift, but I'm envisioning some grinding gears. It'll test Chip's resolve, but it could be cute.

Someone mentioned having someone learn initially by shifting gears for the driver, but that seems like it would be difficult, especially on a column shifter.

Ideas?

[okiemark]

My dad showed me how to "double clutch" which was handy on the old 53 Ford PU that had three on the column and the old wheat trucks. I found it worked on the Jeep too before I tore it up into pieces. It just means you work the clutch again between taking it out of gear and putting it back in. Some of these old guys around here said funny stuff too. They would call a hat similar to what a policeman or bus driver wore as a double clutcher hat.

[LarrBeard]

Lol. I realized I need to write the scene where Chip teaches Becky to drive because their father is too sick. She's smart, but she gets nervous and easily frustrated. I started doing research into mistakes beginners make driving stick shift, but I'm envisioning some grinding gears. It'll test Chip's resolve, but it could be cute.

Someone mentioned having someone learn initially by shifting gears for the driver, but that seems like it would be difficult, especially on a column shifter.

Ideas?

It's really not that hard to do and it lets the new driver do one thing at a time. I did that with my grandson, then I had him put his hand over mine to let him feel the motion.

[Pyrolocks]

It's really not that hard to do and it lets the new driver do one thing at a time. I did that with my grandson, then I had him put his hand over mine to let him feel the motion.

I really like the idea. Could it work on a column shifter? This would be the perfect compromise to help him teach her without her destroying the transmission in her frustration. Is there enough time in shifting to tell someone to move the gear? You would just hold down the clutch while he shifted for you?

[Pyrolocks]

Oh man... I just tried doing research on double clutching and went so deep down the "learn how to drive a manual" rabbit hole, my brain hurts. I might have her father teach her that technique later to help her with shifting, but I doubt he taught Chip that way, so I don't think Chip would teach her like that.

How about stalling? None of the videos I watched mentioned it but I've read that people tend to stall repeatedly while first learning to drive a stick shift. Is that true? Is that any different on older cars as opposed to newer ones?

[okiemark]

The double clutching is mainly done to keep from grinding gears I assume where the synchronizers are worn, but some of the really old trucks may not have had them at all. I tore a tranny apart on a 48 KB-5 International truck once and I don't believe there were synchronizers in there.

[bmorgil]

The Jeeps we mess with are not synchronized in first. Something I forgot more than once with "Senior Chief" on board. I was immediately informed of my lack of knowledge on my equipment! In all seriousness, if you are not used to having an un-synchronized 1st gear and, you drive a lot of stick shift cars, you are going to grind it once or twice in your time. To get it into first if you are moving, you must "double clutch".

For the "Pyro" here's a brief explanation. If you are traveling at a steady speed and you hold that speed, the engines RPM would change depending on the gear you were in. In other words lets say for argument purposes, at 25 MPH in first gear the RPM would be 4000. In 2nd gear at 25 MPH it would be 2300 RPM and in third gear it would be 1400 RPM. So if you are driving along at 25 MPH in 3rd and you shift it down to 2nd, you push in the clutch and as you pull the snifter from 3rd to 2nd the Synchronizer picks up the speed of the 2nd gear and spins it up quickly to that 2300 RPM it needs to be at or, the gears would collide because they are spinning at two different speeds. Now if you desire 1st gear in our little antiques, the game changes. At 25 MPH we need 4000 RPM to be in 1st gear. In second we are only spinning the gears at 2300 RPM. A big difference from the 4000 RPM needed for a smooth shift. If we try to shift there is no synchronizer for first. The mismatch in RPM of over 1500 RPM, will cause damage, noise, chastising, humiliation and grief.

So... you push in the clutch, pull the shift lever into neutral release the clutch and rev the motor (the classic double clutch move) bringing the engine RPM up to the required 4000 RPM for the match. Depress the clutch again and complete the shift then release the clutch in 1st gear. Nothing to it right! It requires practice and knowledge of the RPM's you need to match when shifting at different speeds. It is a blast when you can do it. As an Experimental Test Driver for Spicer, I drove quite a few un-synchronized multi speed transmissions, From 3 speeds to 28 speeds, no synchronizers. The sound of flying through the gears with the double clutch "jamming", is very cool to say the least to a "Gear Heads" ears.

There is an old Movie with Steve McQueen called "Bullitt". As he fly’s through San Francisco in the most famous chase scene ever, he is JAMMING on those gears! He was a real Racing Driver and an Actor well versed at transmission life during long races. Though he didn’t need to, (his transmission was synchronized in all forward gears) he was doubling the SH#@ out of that Ford's 4 speed. This was an old technique used in endurance racing to get maximum life from the transmission as you beat it to death. The sound of Steve shifting is as good as it gets. You hear the distinct RAAH-RAAH as he revs the motor during the shift.

Now there’s more than you wanted to know!

[Pyrolocks]

I'm sorry I seemed to have dropped off of the face of the Earth. I finally wrote the scene where Chip drives to the hospital, but I put less focus on the actual mechanics of driving since I decided to write it from hsi sister's perspective. As an android, Chip's perspective gets bogged down with analysis, especially when he's upset. It would've been a chaotic mess.

Regardless, I tried to include a lot of the sensory stuff you guys mentioned and I'm happy with that, but I feel like it's still missing something to drive home the fact that it's a manual. I wanted to include the movement of his arm as he shifted or at the very least more detail to how he would park the car. I feel stupid, but I know there's no "park". I want it to feel authenitic and almost send my readers back in time to 1979. However, since I wasn't alive then, I'm doing my best.

Any criticism is welcome! I did trim down the scene to focus more on the driving so as not to bore/depress anyone.


The ringing of the phone on her dresser shattered the relative quiet of the house and Becky jumped up to answer. She wondered who would be calling at this hour and her throat closed at the realization. The hospital. She trembled as she held the receiver to her ear. She wasn't sure she'd spoken at all by the time she hung up, but it hadn’t mattered. The blood in her veins was icy cold as her heart pumped it wildly through her. When she walked away from the phone, she felt like she left a part of her soul behind her. A certain numbness had seeped in.

Becky quickly traversed the few feet separating her room from her brother's. She lifted a pencil from his desk, but her shaking fingers let it slip to the floor.

"CHIP!" Her voice sounded harsh and she cringed when he bolted up in bed. He had the option of skipping his POST if the boot prompt was urgent enough. She would imagine the wide eyed look of alarm on his face demonstrated his decision that this qualified.

“What’s wrong?”

"We need to get to the hospital now. The antibiotics aren't working. They don't think dad's going to make it."

Chip blinked hard at the information before he seemed to steel himself. “Okay.”

"How much power do you have?"

"Enough."

He swung his legs out of bed and stood. She watched him look her over, his eyes hesitating for a split second on her quivering hands, but he didn’t mention it. "Did you want to change?"

She glanced down at her pajamas and shook her head. "I don't care what I look like."

"Me neither." He gently led her down to the first floor and they put on their shoes and jackets. Becky waited by the front door while her brother retrieved the keys from the kitchen.

Her feet moved without her instruction on the way to the Jeep. Becky heard the loud squeak of the doors opening and before she knew it, they were both inside with their safety belts fastened. No one else wore them, but dad had always insisted on it and so did Chip.

She stared at the dash, the familiar curves and textures reminding her of so many trips she’d taken with dad. In her mind’s eye, her father turned the key and started the car, but the soft rumbling of the engine wasn’t accompanied by Dr. Parsons’ voice. It was her brother’s.

“Are you ready?”

Shaken from her reminiscing, she looked over and the weight of their circumstance sank in again. “Yeah, I just want to be with dad.”

“Me too.”

She placed her fingers over where his hand sat on the seat between them. “I’ll be quiet so you can concentrate.”

She expected him to rebuttal that he didn’t need quiet to concentrate. She was so used to him confidently explaining that his processors could handle multiple things at once. His uncomfortable grimace implied he was aware of her expectations and couldn’t meet them.

“Thanks.”

Ordinarily, they’d let Eleanor warm up a bit more, but Chip shifted into gear and started down their quiet little road. He stopped at the corner stop sign for a half a second before he gunned it.

The hospital was about 30 minutes away, most of it highway. The speed limit on all of the rural roads up until that point had a speed limit of 25. She leaned over slightly to see the speedometer and confirmed Chip was definitely breaking the law.

The engine for the Jeep growled loudly and Becky listened to all of the dogs in the neighborhood begin to bark. Lights flicked on in some of the houses they passed. At this time of night, there weren’t any other cars on the road, but that changed when they hit the highway.

Beky was afraid of getting pulled over by the police, but Chip had likely already calculated that risk into his behavior. If he was willing to risk it, so was she. When the traffic light ahead of them turned yellow, Eleanor made sounds the teenage girl had never heard before. Her brother’s face was impassive, but she caught him glance over at her once they’d made it through the intersection. He was probably worried about frightening her.

“I trust you completely.”

She watched as his tight grip on the steering wheel loosened ever so slightly and he tossed her a faint smile.

When they approached the next light, it was already red with a car waiting in the left lane. Chip maneuvered into the right lane and the instant the light turned green, that car faded into the background. The sudden momentum pushed Becky back into her seat and the wind pouring through her window stole her breath. Becky hadn’t really been paying attention to where they were, but when she read the sign, her stomach clenched. They were there.

The tires on the Jeep squealed at the sharp turn Chip made into the parking space. When the brake clicked into place and Chip rotated the keys in the ignition, the silence was deafening. All Becky would hear was her racing pulse. She felt like she was going to be sick and hurriedly scrambled out of the car where her brother swiftly joined her.

“Are you okay?”

“No. You?”

He blinked twice. “No.” Still, he took her hand and they entered the hospital, stopping at the information desk to get their visitor’s badges. As they fastened them to their shirts, the balding man behind the desk began giving them directions. Becky’s head swam as she struggled to keep track of the complicated instructions he was giving her. Maybe they were simple and she just wasn’t firing on all cylinders, but she breathed a sigh of relief when Chip politely interrupted him.

“Thank you, but I know the way.”

The man raised an eyebrow and nodded to them as Chip grabbed her hand and broke out into a run. They only slowed momentarily when one of the staff yelled at them. All of the sterile hallways looked the same to Backy and she was thankful Chip had the map stored.

Once they stopped and spoke to the person outside of the door to the ICU, they were allowed into that area. Becky’s eyes slid along the room numbers and when she found 17, her heart sank right out of her body. She hesitated outside, warily looking at the barely cracked door and Chip went stone still beside her, not letting go of her hand. Unlike most of the rooms they had passed, this one was silent. No beeping, no mechanical whirring. Nothing. Maybe she’d remembered the wrong room number?

The nurse who appeared in the doorway jumped when she saw them, but her startled expression turned to one of deep sympathy and it was then Becky knew for sure. They’d missed it. She’d broken her promise to be there for him.

The nurse’s voice was barely a whisper, but she heard it loud and clear. “I've disconnected him from everything, but you can go in to say goodbye whenever you’re ready. I’m so sorry for your loss.”

And just like that, the woman was gone. Something shattered inside of the teenage girl and she wanted to scream and cry at the same time. She somehow managed to do neither. She just stood there as the world crumbled in on her.

“I’m so sorry, Becky.” She looked over her shoulder to find her brother had trailed back. When had he let go of her hand? She turned to face him and her heart ached at the guilt in his eyes.

“This is NOT your fault. If you had driven any faster, it would’ve been dangerous.”

The android swallowed, a nervous habit he’d picked up even if he wasn’t eating. “Correct.”

“Exactly. I don’t think dad would’ve been very happy if we’d joined him, do you?”

“No. He made his intentions for us to live very clear.”

“Then you can’t blame yourself. You did your best and I know he’d be proud.”

[5JeepsAz]

Chills baby!!! Great, a poignant, and sad, scene!

"She knew he was fast by the sound of the cattle guard underneath, whump whomp, danger fast"

"The engine was ticking, almost popping, like the racing of her heart when she past in front of the Jeep to grab her brothers hand. Like it was groaning too, knowing what lie ahead".

C'mon man, the Jeep is less of a cyborg than the robot brother! Give it the character it has, maybe even lines - hell I tell my Jeep secrets!

Honestly, that was touching. Nicely done!

[bmorgil]

Pyro's back!

For a truly tricky experience, the drive could entail the infamous "5JeepsAz keep it running technique", with three pedals and two feet, using all three pedals simultaneously. Life and limb at stake. Surrounded by innocent bystanders in the heat of the desert.True automation. Something that would thrill "Data" himself and stop a "Klingon" in their tracks.

[Pyrolocks]

Chills baby!!! Great, a poignant, and sad, scene!

"She knew he was fast by the sound of the cattle guard underneath, whump whomp, danger fast"

"The engine was ticking, almost popping, like the racing of her heart when she past in front of the Jeep to grab her brothers hand. Like it was groaning too, knowing what lie ahead".

C'mon man, the Jeep is less of a cyborg than the robot brother! Give it the character it has, maybe even lines - hell I tell my Jeep secrets!

Honestly, that was touching. Nicely done!

Thank you! That means a lot! It took forever to write because I knew it would be a tough one. I like all of your ideas, especially the popping and groaning of the hot engine. Do you mind if I use them? My old SUV used to do that, but this new one is completely soulless. I miss the simple things like turning a key to start the engine. *sighs*

Just for you, I will do my best to give her Eleanor a line, but it'll probably be in the scene where Chip tries to teach his sister to drive. For that one, I'll have to pick brains for details.

[Pyrolocks]

Pyro's back!

For a truly tricky experience, the drive could entail the infamous "5JeepsAz keep it running technique", with three pedals and two feet, using all three pedals simultaneously. Life and limb at stake. Surrounded by innocent bystanders in the heat of the desert.True automation. Something that would thrill "Data" himself and stop a "Klingon" in their tracks.

I am back! Ta da!!!! This sounds very interesting, made even more so by the Star Trek references as I'm a die hard Trekkie myself. I wear a TNG comm badge on my work vest, but try as I might, no one will ever beam me home.

[5JeepsAz]

Bmorgil, funny funny dude and possibly true take. Lol. Pyro, keep em coming - it's a great tale so far.

[Pyrolocks]

Bmorgil, funny funny dude and possibly true take. Lol. Pyro, keep em coming - it's a great tale so far.

Thanks! I'm not sure at what point, but Chip will eventually try to teach Becky to drive. Now, she's far from stupid, but she's easily frazzled and highly emotional. I knew it would be a difficult task and it had always been the plan to have it take time before she was comfortable. After talking to you guys, I know I'm going to have them settle for him driving and her just shifting for a while. It's a nice compromise. :) I'll have to resume my research on common mistakes made by beginners when I get a little closer to that scene.