1946 CJ-2A Slightly Above Stock

[JoeyD]

I suppose I will start here. Some pictures from the day I picked him up are over on the introduction but I figured I would start this thread here as I begin to tear down and rebuild.


So I got the front hubs, drums, and backings off this morning. It really seems like the axle and bearings are in great shape. It has some Selectro manual locking hubs that were installed and after some research I believe that was a good upgrade. I knew going in that there was going to need some brake work done so that was the reason to start with the front axles. I am going to convert to disc up there and it appears that Brennan's setup may be the best fit. I have already ordered most of the parts and am waiting for those and a good day for the install. I was pleasantly surprised to find that the lines seem to be intact without leaks. However, there was very little pressure even though there was some movement on the shoes when the pedal was pressed to the floorboard. I have read and heard that using the original single reservoir master cylinder is probably not the best idea with discs especially. Does anyone have any input on whether they have had experience with that? I would really like to test out the conversion with the single before I upgrade to dual and start changing too many more things.

[bmorgil]

OK JoeyD, now lets see those pictures!

5JeepsAz has a lot of experience with converting to Disc's. I would check out his upgrade on his truck. Also TJones has a radically tricked out CJ that is something to see.


https://willysjeepforum.kaiserwillys.com/showthread.php?1772-New-to-the-Forum

[JoeyD]

bmorgil, you weren't kidding about that CJ of TJones. He really did some custom stuff there and I like the way he has that roll cage on the inside. Guess I will just have to work my own magic as he seems to have done. 5JeepsAz really did a nice job on his rig too, but I didn't see exactly where he mentioned if he actually attempted to do the disc conversion with the single cylinder first. Thanks for the quick information grab.

[5JeepsAz]

Hey Joey, yes, it's a good idea to skip off the single cylinder. Won't do fluid push required, even if specs say it will. Master cylinder went in after the discs being in the same spot then you are now. Lost sleep worrying about having these beauty brakes installed and a hole in my bay where the master cylinder should be, in case new ones didn't fit. Turned out fine, good fitment on the fire wall due to good selecting and good wrenching by the guys doing my build. I even looked at some master cylinder with a pedal hanging off and how to insert that through the firewall. Freaking nightmare.

Forum gurus told me about brakes. I didn't listen and with that original singleness in place and freshly serviced original brakes I pounced on the brake pedal and ended up in the other lane before I could say 4wheel disc conversion and a 78 corvette master cylinder. I believed some hack who told me it worked good back then, so, as long as it's serviced, it'll work good now. Not in modern traffic. For me anyway!

We are unified in one thing above all else, and I am glad I finally listened even if I didn't at first: do good brake work.

My build, goal, something serviceable by any modern mechanic, parts available convenient, since it's a daily.That meant upgrade all around. Had a hell of a time locating parts so went modernized.

Had that brake situation been in traffic or near pedestrians, tragedy would have been on me. So I took responsibility not for me, but to protect those around me. Not preaching. Hell I run over fences and near miss fire hydrants on u turns cause I refuse power steering. And I don't have an ebrake.

Sorry long post. Anyways, the word from up high around here is good brakes are essential. Looking forward to your build!

[bmorgil]

Joey, 5JeepsAz is modest, he has more he's not telling you. His system is a nice one. It utilizes a Corvette Dual reservoir master cylinder and 4 wheel disc brakes. In addition he is using a vacuum power booster and a vacuum reservoir to make it act like a modern braking system.

He (Az), has a tendency to run over fences, so good brakes are very important on his vehicles. He also is predisposed to drive in populated areas using driving techniques that require 3 feet and 3 hands, while enjoying the air conditioning. It takes some planning to get Air, and Power Brakes to play nicely together on an old classic motor. There is another member on here who has begun a CJ conversion. I cant find it but, he was going to start with just the rears. That has control issues, so I believe he was aware he needs to do the front first to avoid a dangerous situation. That said I am quite sure a CJ with front discs and stock rear drums will stop on a dime.

[JoeyD]

Az, that makes a ton of since and I have been trying to read as much about this conversion as possible. Sometimes I feel like I am at the end of that firehose trying to drink. Mechanically I feel pretty sound and at this point I am trying to do just about everything myself with a some help from my lady (she ain't bad, it's a bonus). I just want to make sure as you said, "do good brake work". As bmorgil mentioned these 2As weigh nothing and with front disc, rear drum I believe it is going to stop just fine. Just like Dad always said, I just want to do it right the first time. With that being said, it sounds as though you went a little more modern than I have been planning for in the cylinder department. Herm has the Dual Cylinder that mounts in the same location on the frame as the original single is right now. So I suppose it just means, place that order and get it here. Thanks for clearing up the "will it have the pressure it needs" question, really a big help with making the decision.

On an update note, I am having some trouble getting the axle nut off the rear. I want to at least check those rear drums and shoes out before I start running fluid through there and testing after the front conversion. The nut doesn't look that bad it is just seriously on there, both sides. Any tricks for me to get that dang thing off of there? I hate to think I need to resort to anything out of the ordinary. As always thanks for all of the conversion, I really can't stop messing with this CJ now that I have started...lol

[bmorgil]

JoeyD, It is on there as tight as you can imagine. Most who are familiar with the tapered axle are used to them coming loose enough to make noise. The nut should be torqued to 150 to 175 ft lbs of torque. To get it off use the biggest stuff you have and a long leverage bar like a pipe or, a real good impact gun with a lot of air or a big battery. Make sure the cotter key is out.

[5JeepsAz]

Another issue was changing wheels to fit around the discs. Not sure if that's an issue on the CJ but it was on the SJ truck. I did want to do it like you are planning. That's always the best. Start with keeping it original, try mod close to original, fully modern only when needed. Mine had every challenge for the brakes, so the rabbit hole led past Herm and Walcks, though they were super helpful and I met great jeep people, legends really if you think what a few knowledge keepers are doing for guys like us, along the way. It came down to "what's on your Jeep is on your Jeep". I had different drum size than parts available, one truck model later than plumbing available, too early for changing in parts off of the regular j truck set ups although they would have worked if fully transferred it was same thing to just go modern (mine is early in j truck series). These guys on here who had been through kept telling me the build, the journey, is all the fun. Looking back it is all true. But I surely appreciate where you are at with your build. The firehouse as you call it. Keep posting, man. Pictures!!!

[JoeyD]

So at this point I am just tinkering until I get some parts in. Waiting on the calipers, rotors and lines to finish up the front brakes. Now that I understand from Az I guess I need to go ahead and order that dual cylinder. I also need to get that elbow grease in there and get that castle nut off so I can inspect the rear brakes. I think I am gonna see if any body needs the fronts drums cause they seem to be in decent shape. I did remove the square taillights someone put on there and replaced them with round ones. Really just an aesthetic thing but I like it better. I need to check the brake light switch, but the parking and taillight works just fine. I am curious as to how far with an engine review I need to go. I mean he runs really smooth but it is obvious some PM needs to happen. Here are a few pics I snapped today.75577558755975607561

[gmwillys]

Start with a good inspection of the engine. But, if it isn't leaking, leave it alone. You might want to look into adjusting the valves. Read about it, and watch all the videos that you can find so you know everything you will ever need to know about tappets.

[LarrBeard]

You have your priorities right - good brakes! !!

As they say in that phone commercial; "If the brakes don't stop it, something else will"

And old lifters will clatter a bit.

[JoeyD]

So update, even with this crazy Texas cold snap I managed to get out there and do a few things. On that note, he does not like the cold at all. But after some serious sweet talk and a little ether he fired and ran good. I did the first oil change and let me tell you I have never seen oil that black unless it came straight from the ground. But got it done and the plug looks to still hold a good seal with no leaks anywhere else either. I put 5 quarts of ND 30 and it seems to like that with hardly any burn coming out. I can also tell you that I have no idea how he even got for to start with the plugs that I pulled out of there. They were some kind of rusted on top and black as can be on the ends. But I got the new ones in and he starts great. Here are a couple of pics from those 2 jobs. Back to the front brakes as soon as I get the rest of the parts.7618761876177619

[gmwillys]

I do believe you got every bit of good out of both the oil and plugs. He will sure like the new plugs and transfusion.

[bmorgil]

WOW! Texas crude. When you look at those plugs it is a great sign the ignition is strong. It had to be to fire those iron oxides!

[JoeyD]

Alright folks, I am kinda freaking out a little.So I told y’all about the trouble starting in the cold but eventually he came back to life. Ran great as always for a little while and then shut him down for the night. Not sure if anyone has been tracking the weather in Texas but it has been crazy for the area to say the least. Went back out this morning because I want to run him as often as possible to keep him from sitting while I work on the things to get him on the road. And what I heard has me really worried and almost lost. Almost a complete lack of wanting to turn over. Before there was no issue turning over just would not fire. Today it was almost like it was frozen from the word go. I didn’t want to try too hard cause I was afraid to do more harm than good. What in the world could have caused the sudden change. It has been converted to 12v, alternator, newer starter and the battery has some years on it but has been holding a charge. Please help me calm down or face what I may have to.

[Trailabite]

Alright folks, I am kinda freaking out a little.So I told y’all about the trouble starting in the cold but eventually he came back to life. Ran great as always for a little while and then shut him down for the night. Not sure if anyone has been tracking the weather in Texas but it has been crazy for the area to say the least. Went back out this morning because I want to run him as often as possible to keep him from sitting while I work on the things to get him on the road. And what I heard has me really worried and almost lost. Almost a complete lack of wanting to turn over. Before there was no issue turning over just would not fire. Today it was almost like it was frozen from the word go. I didn’t want to try too hard cause I was afraid to do more harm than good. What in the world could have caused the sudden change. It has been converted to 12v, alternator, newer starter and the battery has some years on it but has been holding a charge. Please help me calm down or face what I may have to.

You might try putting an electric heater under it and warm up the block and see what happens. When I was in high school I inherited an old mustang from an uncle and it would do this in the winter time.

[bmorgil]

Deep breath, check out the easy stuff first Gotta check the condition of the battery. If you have no means to do it yourself (voltmeter), Take the battery to your local auto parts store and tell them to check it out. If the battery is good, rent or buy a 1 3/8" socket and a way to turn it. This socket should fit the crankshaft nut. If you have or have access to the hand crank, this will also do the trick https://www.kaiserwillys.com/starter-hand-crank-fits-41-45-mb-gpw .

See if you can get the motor to turn over by hand. If it was running fine when you shut it off I am sure it will be running fine again.

[LarrBeard]

Here may be an idea. The oil you drained was really nasty stuff, but we don’t know its’ viscosity. It could have been 10W30 or even 5W30. You refilled it with 30W non-detergent oil, a good choice normally - but in the current Texas cold, straight 30W is going to be hard to move around.

Check the battery. I agree with the heater suggestion - maybe even a blanket to hold warm air under the Jeep. Don’t panic yet, just make sure there is anti-freeze in it!

[JoeyD]

Thanks guys I really appreciate the suggestions and reassuring words. Trailabite I have been looking for a heater but of course those were the first things to go around here after the eggs and milk. Still looking and maybe I'll try the blanket in the meantime.

Bmorgil, I have had a charger on the battery most of the time but I didn't consider that at this point I may have gotten the last out of it. I knew you could hand crank but as strong as the starter and battery had been I hadn't thought that could be a way to rule some things out. I will see what I need to get to try that out. I really want this weather to break to see if that makes all the difference.

Larrbeard that has been running through my mind the whole time. Even growing up in Arkansas where it can get this cold I never saw this happen. But then again I never used straight 30W. I have already been religiously checking the fluid in the radiator and it has stayed consistent.

Would yall think I might just be better to let these temps rise before i try again and go from there? It is just real hard with all this free time and looking out the window at it just waiting to be driven. But I am going to keep tinkering with other things until this crap clears up. Hopefully before it ever happens again I can get moved to warmer weather. Thanks again and I will keep y'all updated.

[gmwillys]

I agree with the battery. Batteries will crap out overnight, when the weather changes drastically. In a usual warm climate like Texas, the battery doesn't see big swings in temperature over its life span. When you hit down in to the single digits, the battery can't take it. I've never had battery issues until moving to a warmer climate. In the far north, I could park a vehicle in the fall, and it would sit all winter without being on a charger. It the spring, fill up the float bowls with fuel and the garbage would fire right up. The temps in the winter would get down to -20 to -30 during the storage period, but it wouldn't effect the battery performance or the life span. Battery brands do not seem to make a difference around here either. I have run Interstates and Exides for years, and both do not last as long here in comparison.

I would also check the antifreeze to ensure that the freezing point isn't too high.

[bmorgil]

Joey, I am only suggesting the socket or crank to see if the motor is rotating freely. DO NOT try to start the motor with a socket wrench on the crank nut. Very bad things will happen if it starts! I am suggesting with the key OFF, try to rotate the engine just to make sure the motor didn't strangely freeze up as you mentioned. I have a feeling you have a voltage problem, the battery is highly suspect. If that's not it, and you can turn the motor freely by hand, some basic voltage/amperage checks should get you to the culprit.

[JoeyD]

GM, I understand what you mean and the swing has been crazy. I have had a battery in my daily driver crap out in less than 6 months here for no apparent reason.

Bm I am sure that would be very bad. And it does seem that the motor turns freely just seems like it is trying too hard when you turn the key. As far a voltage issue I am putting a pic on here because I have noticed something peculiar and worrisome. The negative ground is attached to the alternator bracket mounted to the front of the block. It seems to get real hot and has melted some of the sheathing around the cable. Is this the normal place to put it? Or did someone just wing it?7621

[gmwillys]

The ground is located correct location as with the stock generator would have been. I would grab a multimeter to measure the resistance from the negative battery terminal to the alternator mount where your ground cable terminates. If the resistance is low, check from the negative batt terminal to the braided ground cable at the engine mount. Grease and general crud can reduce the ground flow to the frame. If all is good, check the starter out.

[PaulB]

My M38A1 came with Easylok front hubs. They are set in the free position. Do I need to manually set them in the lock position to get any kind of 4 wheel drive? In other words, transferring from 2W to 4W high, should the jeep move or would I hurt anything? I would think I absolutely need to set them to lock position to go from 4W High to 4W Low.

[gmwillys]

PaulB,

The manual hubs will need to be set to lock for the front wheels to be engaged for four wheel drive to work. The hubs are intended to reduce wear on the front axle by disconnecting the wheel hubs from the axles. This is done to also act as a fuel savings measure by eliminating the parasitic load of having to turn all the internals of the front differential while driving. In short, if the hubs are disconnected from the axles, you are not turning the ring gear and axles.

You can place the transfer case in four wheel drive, and have the hubs in the free position, but it isn't recommended for driving. Also, be sure both hubs are set to the same position. On numerous occasions, I have seen where one hub was locked in, and the other out. On occasion if I am using one of my Heeps for yard maintenance work, where I want the gear reduction of using four wheel low, but do not want to tear up the yard or need to turn on the driveway, I will unlock the hubs to prevent damage. Again, I don't drive on the hard road with the four wheel drive four high/four low engaged because it causes undue stress on the whole four wheel drive system. You can lock the front hubs in though, and drive in two wheel drive with no issues. Then all you would need to do is pull the transfer case levers into the desired mode you wish to use without having to worry about locking and unlocking the hubs. When I lived in a arctic climate, the hubs would be engaged in late October and stayed engaged throughout winter until the following April.

[JoeyD]

GM, I will check and see what that reading is. I also checked the battery itself yesterday and at full charge, according to the charger, it read almost 13.5 volts. That is way too high, but after a couple of turns on the key it was already back below 12.5. I think I really need to get into that electrical system even though it was something I thought was in pretty decent shape.

PaulB, GM hit it right on the head. I remember my old '86 Yota I had as a teenager hated having the hubs locked and doing more than about 25 mph. I know now it could have just been some bearings needed replaced but I can still hear that whine if I came out of the woods and forgot to unlock them. It is my understanding, correct me if I am wrong guys, but these CJs did not come with manual locking hubs orginally. I know it can be annoying but generally I never locked them in unless I thought I was gonna need it. My 2A has Selectro locking hubs and they seem to be super easy to lock and unlock.

[gmwillys]

You are correct Joey. The locking hubs were an aftermarket accessory well into the CJ5 production. What turned the corner for Willys and later Kaiser to start putting them on from the factory was through the competition putting them on their units as a selling feature. International Scouts had IH branded Warn locking hubs on their vehicles, then Ford followed suit on the Broncos.

More information than you could probably ever want to know from eWillys.com;

http://www.ewillys.com/?s=locking+hubs

On the electrical side of things, it would appear that you do have some rather high resistance.

[5JeepsAz]

GM thanks for the locking hubs explanation & info!

[bmorgil]

GM, I understand what you mean and the swing has been crazy. I have had a battery in my daily driver crap out in less than 6 months here for no apparent reason.

Bm I am sure that would be very bad. And it does seem that the motor turns freely just seems like it is trying too hard when you turn the key. As far a voltage issue I am putting a pic on here because I have noticed something peculiar and worrisome. The negative ground is attached to the alternator bracket mounted to the front of the block. It seems to get real hot and has melted some of the sheathing around the cable. Is this the normal place to put it? Or did someone just wing it?7621

No signs of melting or heat should be anywhere in your electrical system. You have found a source of current loss. It needs to be fixed. I am sure that is a good part of the problem. Red hot wires are the definition of current draw. There is some "Winging" going on but I am not sure for what. The wires taped up and stuck under the clamp nut on the battery terminals are not stock. It looks like you have a few things tapped into the electrical system. I would start by following gm's line of thinking. Start looking for voltage loss. As gm said if all is good pull the starter and have it checked at the auto parts store. Remember a battery can read fully charged (Voltage reading) and have zero amperage capability. This is why they must be checked under load. Just a voltage check at the battery has fooled a lot of people. Maybe LarrBeard can school us on "surface charge" here, if he see's this.

Put a voltmeter on the starter from the positive wire connection to ground. It should be exactly the same as the voltage at the Positive battery post. Crank the motor and see what the voltage drops to. If the voltage drops below 9 or 10 volts at the starter that's too low. Check it at the battery terminals while cranking. If it drops below 9 or 10 volts, the battery has lost its amp-pacity. If it is higher at the Battery while cranking than it is at the starter by more than .2 (point two) volts. You have a wiring issue. If all seems good and the battery is checking OK at the auto parts store, you probably have a bad starter. You really need to use an inductive ammeter to check the starter on the car but, if you have made these checks and the starter is getting hot, it is suspect. Keep after it Joey!

[JoeyD]

Bm I definitely need to do some checking on the electrical system. There is something going on there and I need to find it before something really gets too hot. You are correct that there are several things tied into there. Winch and KC lights for a start.

On a great note though, as temperature began to rise I decided to see what may happen. I took the battery to the parts store and it checked out good. So I came back and in the middle of the day when the sun was just right I tried again. And what do you know, he finally decided to give me enough to turn it over. I went out and cranked him yesterday too and didn't even need the choke. I will tell y'all this though, I have done so much reading and listening to y'all that I have alot better understanding of how these things are laid out and can be stubborn. I will keep you all updated.

Second note, I cleaned off the drums and shoes from the front that I plan on converting to disc. You would not believe the meat still left on those, you can still see some black lettering on the shoes. Actually considering throwing them back on till my calipers, rotors and lines come in. Really had a big hiccup on those and I am not gonna be able to wait much longer before I get behind the wheel.

Thanks again and I will be doing alot more checking of that electrical system.

[bmorgil]

All good Joey!

[JoeyD]

Yet another Hiccup. So I had some issues with a broken bolt on one of my front hubs. The bolt is for the axle flange and I just could not get it out after I broke the head off. So I opted to order new hubs. They were fairly inexpensive and of course new parts equal a little more piece of mind. However, I got them in and started reinstalling the races, bearings and oil seals. Big problem though, the races dropped straight and are now tight. I can literally put them in and take them out with my fingers. The biggest deal is that the oil seals will not seat at all because they are so small. Did I get the wrong hubs, Crown Automotive SKUS437. Now I know I didn't get them from Kaiser's but I thought the price difference was worth it. Can I possibly get new races and oil seal or am I gonna have to return those hubs?

[bmorgil]

Joey, the parts sound out of dimension. If you are certain you have the right bearing races, they are held to some pretty tight tolerances, that means the hubs are suspect. A lot of crown stuff comes from third world sources. Sometimes you have to make it work. In this case, send it back. The races are a slight press. Too tight will ruin them too loose will ruin them. If you want to get scientific, the installation bore size for the race should be available from the bearing manufacturer. You don't have to pound them in but, they don't fall in either. Are you certain you cant get the broken bolt out? Shoot me a picture of that broken bolt. I might be able to help you there. It is not uncommon to have all but a couple flange bolts broken. I definitely have removed, and seen the removal of many. They are supposed to be grade 8 bolts. Many types end up in there. Cheap bolts break when the poor guy tries to do the right thing and torque them. Or the darn air gun was strong that day!

[gmwillys]

I agree with Bmorgil. I would remove the broken bolt, and return the out of speck hub. If you run into a problem, drop me a note with your address, and I'll send you an original hub. I've got a few on the shelf, that just need to be cleaned up and new bearings and seals installed.

Just an option to throw out there.

[bmorgil]

Super options from gm there Joey, both of them. Original hubs if you can.

[JoeyD]

bmorgil, gmwillys I thought that was probably the right answer and I completely did as you suggested and contacted Morris to send those back. They agreed that I more than likely received the wrong hubs and are sending me a return label. As for the axle flange bolt I will get you that picture and you can tell me with you think.

I will be honest that I really wanted to test the brakes this past weekend so I put everything back together with the one missing bolt. I had already done so much cleaning and my schedule only gives me small windows right now. So I took full advantage because I removed the fill cap on the Master cylinder and found it almost bone dry. I refilled, bled the brakes and found no links in lines. I still have alot of pedal travel so I have been reading the manual to do some adjustments. I am finding some issues that I won't say I am surprised about but was really hoping wouldn't be there. I knew I probably needed to go through the whole thing front to back which isn't an issue, I just didn't want to find anything wrong. I know that was naïve of me, but hey a guy can dream right. As I started to pull out from under the canopy I noticed that I was getting any power to the rear axle. If I engage the front hubs and put it in 4wd my front end has no problem taking me where I want to go. So I did some research and I think that I have ruled out a broken axle rod because the drive shaft turns. Now you may ask if when it is in gear can I turn the rear wheels as well. The answer is yes. I suppose I need to start looking at where drive shaft enters the trans to determine why the rear axle is not engaging. Does that sound about right?

[LarrBeard]

I also checked the battery itself yesterday and at full charge, according to the charger, it read almost 13.5 volts.

That's OK for a battery just off charge. It will settle down a few tenths after it sits for a bit and will pull down to about 12.7 - 12.5 after just a bit of cranking.

If anything is getting hot - it is either a bad connection or badly overloaded. For an example, at stall a 12-volt starter will pull about 350 to 400 amps. It cranks at about 125 to 150 amps. That's a lot of current and even a few milli-ohms (1/1000 of an ohm) will start to generate hot spots.

Clean, bright and tight are the watch words for good electrical connections.

[bmorgil]

Joey a little confused on your problem. Are you saying in two wheel drive it will not move? In other words if you disengage the transfer case to the front axle (shift it into 2 wheel drive completely disengaging the front drive) the jeep wont move? If it is sitting there in 2 wheel drive not moving with the rear driveshaft spinning, and you are not moving, the rear axle has a problem.

[JoeyD]

LarrBeard, that is good news to hear about the battery and that is exactly what is happening. Since the thaw the old guy has starting loosening up a bit and is way more easy to get started. In fact, most of the time now there is no need for any choke and only after a couple of days do I need to pump that accelerator a little. Clean is not word I would use for very much on the rig right now, that is partly my fault and partly because that is how I got it. Grandad always told me that things tend to work better when they are clean and I need to get back to that.

bmorgil, That is correct. When I have the middle lever in the "out" position and the right lever in the "high" position it would not move. I did quite a bit of reading last night and went out to do some tinkering when I got home late. After some TLC and a little sweet talking I believe the right lever was sticking in neutral. So I finally got him to move without the front axle engaged. I found that if that right lever is in neutral it stops power transfer to both of the axles. It does take some serious accelerator pressure to start moving in 2wd. I don't notice anything slipping and I want to possibly contribute it to the 34x10.5 Swampers that came on it. These are probably fine for 4wd and off road but could that be a little too much rubber to push with just the rear axle?

[bmorgil]

I think you have it figured out. The "lever in the middle" would be the transfer case "In" (engaged) and "Out" (disengaged). This controls the power flow through the transfer case. "In" engaged, has power flowing to the front and rear. The lever on the right is the "Range" of the transfer case "Low" and "High", with a neutral in the middle. It can be difficult to get everything to shift. Sometimes it takes a little TLC and slight clutching to get the gears to line up. You probably have tried this technique but just in case, if it seems like it just wont make a positive shift, release the clutch ever so slightly while you try to engage the gear with the shift lever. Be careful here you are trying to line up the gear teeth. You don't want to hear grinding. This is a real "feel" thing. It's like riding a bike however. Once you get used to jumping between the gear positions, it gets a lot easier to feel it. These old transfer cases and transmissions require a bit of touch. It was something you were used to having to do in the 40's, 50's and 60's. The new stuff we have today requires very little driver interaction. A button here or electronic joy stick shifter over there! The directness of the shifter mechanism on the Dana 18 transfer case and the bulk of the components in the gear box is primitive by today's standards. I have to get everything just right on mine every now and then to get her in gear.

How does it do in "Low" range? You need to have the transfer case "In" engaged to shift into "Low" range. Unless someone removed it, there is an interlock in the shift mechanism that prevents the engagement of "Low" unless the Transfer Case is "In" engaged. If the Transfer case has been rebuilt, some mechanics leave the interlock out. If it seems to move with no problem in low but is hard to move in High. Your tire observation is a good one. 34" tall tires knocks the overall drive ratio down numerically. Your Jeep however has axle ratios that can handle that tire size without being to difficult to drive. If it is hard to move make sure you aren't dragging a brake. Also be sure the Emergency brake isn't sticking on, this can make it very difficult to shift it into gear.

[gmwillys]

You got it! On a lot of original tubs, there tends to be a hole pounded into the side of the tunnel to where a pry bar was jammed in to "persuade" the lever into full travel to the (In) position. Most of the holes would make you think that the hole was created with a pick axe.

[LarrBeard]

"Most of the holes would make you think that the hole was created with a pick axe."

Or Ira's BFH

[5JeepsAz]

I miss him. Glad we have his thread

[JoeyD]

bmorgil, in low there aren't any issues with power. Of course with that factory steering it isn't much fun to turn starting out. I do not have a hole per se, but the rubber but is long since gone. So I have a new one of those on order. As far as a stuck brake is concerned, I really need to get those rear hubs off and do some inspecting. I also seem to have some fluid coming out of the passenger rear drum backing. So I need to get in there.

I read through most of Ira's post and I have to say that I wish I could have been here when he was around.

[LarrBeard]

["I read through most of Ira's post and I have to say that I wish I could have been here when he was around.[/QUOTE]

Miss Amy is working up an Ira Tribute, wait for it ...

The "The Darned Thing is Out..." thread is getting several hundred hits a day even now.

[gmwillys]

In the discussion on the pick axe hole punched in the floor board, here is an example of the barbaric modification on our Heep.

[bmorgil]

Ohhh gm I think I recognize that hole! The pin that retains the shifters will hit the tunnel right there when you try to remove it, if you are removing the shift levers without dropping the transfer case down a little. I actually contemplated putting a hole there on purpose with a plug, just to make it easier to pull the levers. I did see a few older 2's and 3's with a hole right there when I was looking for one. I wondered about that hole and then mine, like TJ's, stated dripping. I went to pull the levers and I discovered why the holes were right there. The pin comes out a little and bang hits the tunnel right there. All you have to do is drop the cross member a fuzz and it comes out. The hole however would be much faster!

[gmwillys]

There was a multi purpose remnant of a piece of round stock laying on the floor for years. If the detents rust up, and the shafts get globed up with crud, the bar goes in to "assist" the changing of the selectors. They are clean now, and work very well, but once upon a time in history, they must have not moved so easily. The pin clearance is another possibility I didn't really think about. I've gotten so used to pulling the body off on other projects that needed transfer case help. There is just enough room to slide the shifters through the floor when raising the body.

[TJones]

Ohhh gm I think I recognize that hole! The pin that retains the shifters will hit the tunnel right there when you try to remove it, if you are removing the shift levers without dropping the transfer case down a little. I actually contemplated putting a hole there on purpose with a plug, just to make it easier to pull the levers. I did see a few older 2's and 3's with a hole right there when I was looking for one. I wondered about that hole and then mine, like TJ's, stated dripping. I went to pull the levers and I discovered why the holes were right there. The pin comes out a little and bang hits the tunnel right there. All you have to do is drop the cross member a fuzz and it comes out. The hole however would be much faster!

Makes Perfect sense now, I had everything in and bolted up and went to put put the levers in and Son-of-Beach the pin wouldn't go in...............I had to un-bolt the cross member and drop it down about like you said Bob a "fuzz" and the pin went in, on the other hand you can get the levers out without dropping the cross member bc the pin comes out far enough to get both levers out but the pin won't come out, the Ole boys in Toledo back 60-65 years ago must of laid awake at night thinking how they could aggravate the 21st century back yard mechanics/wannabes :):):)

[TJones]

There was a multi purpose remnant of a piece of round stock laying on the floor for years. If the detents rust up, and the shafts get globed up with crud, the bar goes in to "assist" the changing of the selectors. They are clean now, and work very well, but once upon a time in history, they must have not moved so easily. The pin clearance is another possibility I didn't really think about. I've gotten so used to pulling the body off on other projects that needed transfer case help. There is just enough room to slide the shifters through the floor when raising the body.

Wanna hear something about that GM, I went to loosen up the set screw to pull the pin out so I could get the levers out when I dropped everything to the floor and the set screw was twisted off in the hole, that's when I got out the bucket and was beside myself thinking I was going to have to raise the body up enough to clear the levers. Well after a couple Winston's and 2-3 Heinekens I got the sawzall out and made really short shift levers and said piss on it I will fix them when I getter all out on the floor.
Needless to say when you go to glue them back together you have to braze them bc they are cast, got it back together finally.

[JoeyD]

Well folks it seems to shift okay right now. I am hoping, however it appears there may be some engineering that I will have to do as well. All part of the fun with these old Jeeps right? I had to take a little break due to work taking me out of the house for 12-14 hours a day. But hopefully I will get some new parts in and get the rear brakes exposed soon. It really seems like maybe something is not right back there instead of a transmission issue. Are these "modifications" something that is relatively normal or do yall think I will be able to do the routine maintenance that has been lacking in order to correct alot of problems?

[bmorgil]

I think some routine maintenance and a little "freeing" up of parts and it'll come right back.

[JoeyD]

Alright folks, time to get back at it. I have to have this thing road worthy by August. The fiance thinks she wants to ride in it from the wedding. It has been killing me not being able to work on this thing for the last month or so. Here is where I am, I still need to get those rear brakes exposed so I can see what the damage is going to be. Really seems like something is sticking but I hope it is a simple clean and seal. I have gotten one castle nut off the rear, but the other one has already broken one breaker bar. I am giving this thing all I got. I think I am gonna have to get an impact on it but that is the one thing I don't have at my disposal. After that happens I still have to wait for the hub puller to come in, because apparently that is a tool for these old things that nobody has local. I will keep yall posted and hopefully things can go smoother from here on out.

[bmorgil]

You are on the right track Joey. The right tools will make life easier. The hub puller is good insurance. With the way that nut is coming off, the drum might be on there solid. You may want to rent a 3/4" drive breaker bar and socket or a 3/4" drive impact. Soak it with penetrating oil. Kroil if you can find it.

[gmwillys]

Joey, if you have a plumber's torch, (hand held propane or Map gas torch) use it to warm up the hub nut enough for it to get hot. Spray some penetrating oil at the threads while hot then repeat the process. It isn't as effective as an acetylene torch, but will aid the oil in to the threads to help release the bond. If you do not have access to an impact, you can take a hammer and whack the socket while applying pressure with the breaker bar. Maybe the bride to be could help with the beating. Just be careful if the socket isn't an impact socket. Chrome sockets can flake or worse crack when hammering.

[bmorgil]

Maybe the bride to be could help with the beating.......

I can't leave that statement alone... but I will.

Along the lines of gm's thinking, there are some powerful heat guns out there for cheap. I think China Freight has some strong ones. It doesn't have to get red hot. The expansion and contraction of the heating and cooling cycles is the trick. If you can get the nut to heat up and grow faster than the stub, it will break the two loose from each other. The lube will get drawn in by capillary action. Use a big 3/4" drive socket.

[5JeepsAz]

I can't leave that statement alone... but I will..

You thinking it should say, "buy jeep parts to arrive in large boxes unannounced on day of repair to guarantee bride help with ...

[JoeyD]

Well it didn't take the bride to be doing any beating...although I would imagine there are some days she would like to. I got it off checked those shoes and drums, did some adjusting on them and there we go. My pedal still has a little too much travel but with the fiances help I am going to bleed them again and hopefully that does the trick. I took it for a couple spins around the neighborhood. Talking with the stepdad it sounds like it may be missing a little. So I am gonna start with new wires and a distributer tune up. After that I need to go ahead and get him tagged and I might actually have this thing ready pretty soon. Thanks for all the help. I would still be cussing if not for y'alls advice.

[JoeyD]

Alright folks, so I know I owe a lot of updates and definitely some pictures. I will get those uploaded tonight. Many things have happened since the last time I posted and Lloyd doesn't look at all the same. Unfortunately, I was not ready to put my new bride in him coming back from the lake where the wedding was held. But, it was a nice talking piece for the guests at the reception. I have been constantly making adjustments and "improvements", which mainly involve changing worn out parts or trying to stop leaks. At the moment I am tackling a fuel distribution problem that I believe is a combination of needing a carburetor rebuild and possibly a new fuel pump. As with most of what I have begun to find on this 2A, neither are stock and I have to do a lot of research just to find the part or rebuild kit that I need. One in particular appears to be that the pump on this 134 is from somewhere between a CJ3 or CJ5 because that is the only comparable pump I have found that even resembles it. At any cost, I am constantly making progress and by the end of it I think, and I mean think that I will have a sold 2A.

[bmorgil]

Keep at it Joey, we are looking forward to the updates!

[JoeyD]

Thanks bm, I really appreciate it. Here are those pics I promised. 88648865886688678868

[bmorgil]

Looks like a true worker that's for sure Joey! That Jeep looks ready to go anywhere.

[51 CJ3]

I like it. It is giving me some ideas for my 3A.

[JoeyD]

Bm, it does pretty good that is for sure. Those oversized tires aren't fun over 30mph, so I think that will be the next big change. I am okay dropping down some as long as I don't get too top heavy.

Jeff, it certainly has some different looks than an all original flat fender but I feel that it is a good mix of old and new.

Situation now is fuel delivery. I have the Solex Carb and that later style Fuel Pump pulled off. I got the rebuild kit from Kaiser for the carb and I believe I will just replace the pump. The numbers on the carb make me think that it is fairly new so I don't want to give up on it just yet. I have also read a lot about proper adjustments on those to make sure they don't run too rich. I am getting to some points where my knowledge is being tested, so I am learning a lot as I go. Are there any nuggets of wisdom as it pertains to the fuel delivery system I might should be aware of? As always, thanks for all the feedback.

[bmorgil]

The Solex can be a challenge to get right. Make sure the fuel pressure is correct for the carburetor you have.

[JoeyD]

Bm, I have certainly read plenty of bad comments on the Solex or "Solex Design" carbs. That is something that I will certainly have to figure out exactly how to do. I have also read that some people have installed a regulator in order to get it right. I would like to just get a Carter and move back to the original, but at this point that would still be way more expensive than trying to get this one right.

[51 CJ3]

I need to have a look a how mine is set up on the 3A. When I bought it it would barely run for several reasons, one of which was the carb. I had the local parts store order me a kit for the Solex. Mostly, all I did was blow out the carb with carb cleaner, install the new parts in the kit and adjust it per the book. It ran good for a couple of years until I parked it to do other work. I think it’s the original Solex but don’t know how to tell for sure. Maybe I just got lucky.

[JoeyD]

Jeff, that is what I am hoping for on this one. It did sit for a little while I believe, but the carb doesn't look too bad on the outside. So hopefully once I get this kit in I can rebuild it and that will fix my problems. Did yours look very dirty at first observation?

[51 CJ3]

Mine was terrible to look at. A kid had been river running with it. Everything was full of sand. Even had a little in the float bowl. Plus it wasn’t on the base gasket right so it had a big air leak there as well. Take care placing it on the base gasket. As I recall, it is pretty easy to miss the gasket on one side.

[JoeyD]

Gotcha, mine might not look terrible per se but it ain't pretty. I still have to open it up and see what the inside looks like. I have several leaks as well including on the base. So I really need to replace those gaskets. I will certainly heed your word and be careful.

[JoeyD]

I am at a loss folks. I removed the carb, did a thorough cleaning, replaced the fuel pump, and even cut out some bad line. It appears I am getting no fuel coming out of the pump. I have an inline filter, just a normal aftermarket WIX like was on it when I got it. So I can see that no fuel is getting to there either. The tank was moved to the rear and has a rubber hose running from there to the pump. I need to do some more inspection of that but right now I just don't know what else it could be.88798880

[bmorgil]

Check any old rubber hoses that may have been sitting with fuel in them. If there was any ethanol in it, I have seen older hoses swell completely shut on the inside.

[51 CJ3]

Bmorgil is correct. If fuel is coming out of the tank then the hose must be plugged somehow. Alcohol will cause rubber to swell and can swell some hoses shut if they are made of the wrong compound. Alcohol blended fuels are not allowed in aircraft for that very reason. I would disconnect both ends of the hose and blow through it or bypass it with another hose to check it. It’s also a good opportunity to make sure the tank outlet isn’t plugged.

[JoeyD]

Alright guys. I am going to pull that hose this afternoon and check the tank. I will y'all one thing, if the Lord wanted to test me on patience he found the perfect lesson. I will let you know how it goes. Does that look like a Solex remake to y'all or an original. The only markings are a date 4-2016 and P3LEN.

[LarrBeard]

"I have an inline filter, just a normal aftermarket WIX like was on it when I got it."

The filter should be between the pump and the carburetor. Fuel pumps "push" much harder that they "suck" and a filter between the tank and the pump can be a blockage that the pump can't handle.

But - if the filter is between the carb and pump - I'm agreeing with a blocked rubber hose. It may not be blocked if you blow on it, but it may collapse when suction is applied, like a soggy straw in a milkshake.

Or, you may find something totally different that will make you say "Duhhh ". It's an old Jeep and one of its jobs is to keep you puzzled. Good Luck!

[bmorgil]

The Solex was never an original on a Willys. On yours it came originally with a Carter. The Solex is a French Manufactured aftermarket replacement carburetor.

[LarrBeard]

"Does that look like a Solex remake to y'all or an original. "

Although Solex carburetors are OK, there are also many, many accounts of Solex carbs that just never work "right" (vs. yours that just isn't getting gas to do anything).

One guy had so much trouble that he finally found that the best solution was to have his buddy throw the Solex as far as he could out the back door of the shop and then promise not to tell him which direction he threw it... (yeah - probably a joke).

Let us know what you find - we really are curious and it will probably help the next guy with a fuel problem. (We've had a lot of fuel line/fuel pump issues this summer and fall..).

[51 CJ3]

The Solex was never an original on a Willys. On yours it came originally with a Carter. The Solex is a French Manufactured aftermarket replacement carburetor.

I didn’t know this. Someone told me I would have to change the manifold to install the Carter so I assumed it was luck of the draw from Willys.

[bmorgil]

Solex made and still has a carburetor like yours that will bolt right on. The flange "base" on those carbs (the Carter and the Solex) dates way back into the 1920's. A lot of that base pattern on all kinds of things from old Fords and Chevy's to Tractors and Generators.

[JoeyD]

Thanks for info guys. I knew that it would have originally been a Carter, but I have seen several Solex remakes out there. So I wasn't sure if it is actually a Solex or a knock off. I rip that line out and it does not look good. Larrbeard may have hit it in regards to the condition. It's doesn't appear there is a "blockage" but the deterioration is evident even from the outside. I checked the results on that type of tubing and it ain't states that it deteriorates way faster than r9, especially when introduced to alcohol added fuel. So I am gonna head down to the parts store and get some new stuff. The tank seems good cause the fuel cames flowing out as soon as I unhooked it. I would have used the drain plug but the previous owner sealed it off. :eek:88818882

[JoeyD]

The filter is between the pump and the carb. I looks through some of the posts on here and some research told me that there was never a filter on these originally, but I am gonna leave it on anyhow.

[bmorgil]

The original filter is the screen in the fuel pump bowl. It is definitely a good idea to have a filter between the pump and the carb.

I have not heard of a Solex "knock off" until now, but the thought of a Chinese knock off of a French carburetor is terrifying! Solex has changed ownership and manufacturing locations a few times over the years. For a long while they were made in China.

[JoeyD]

Bm, you can find them from Omix and Crown I believe. They have them on Quadratec and Morris maybe I saw. Y'all know my past with Crown I probably wouldn't buy one, but they are there so I wasn't sure if this one could be one.
Well, replaced the whole line. No leaks, still no fuel...I know it's hard because I have a custom setup. But man I did not think it was this complicated and the worst part is that it runs great when it gets fuel.

[JoeyD]

So I tested to see if I had furl coming through the line...yes I did it the hard way. And no, I would not recommend it but it was all I could do. I pulled the pump again to see if there wasn't least coming through when the cam was pressed and it is. Hooked everything back and nothing. Tomorrow is another day of troubleshooting. I told my wife that all I want for Christmas is for this thing to run right...we shall see.

[bmorgil]

Joey if you are able to pull fuel all the way to the pump and verify that the supply line is clear, there is only a few things it can be. You might have a faulty fuel pump. If the line is clear on the suction side with no leaks and the pump wont draw fuel it might have a bad diaphragm or valve in the pump.

At this point I would take the pump off, hook up a supply to it and pump it by hand to verify it is good. Is that what you are saying you have done? If it pumps fuel by hand, the supply line is clear and not leaking and it still wont pump fuel, the pump arm is not being moved by the engine camshaft fuel pump lobe. Either it is the wrong pump, the arm is bent or the cam has a bigger problem. There just isn't much more to these.

Keep us posted Joey! You are having a time with this one.

[LarrBeard]

"So I tested to see if I had fuel coming through the line...yes I did it the hard way. And no, I would not recommend it"

Yeah, we've all had to resort to that at one time or another. You get a swig of gas, diesel or kerosene and then you get this great idea of going in the house and asking the wife for a kiss: "You taste like gasoline --- ytucckkk - get away from me".

Well, it seemed like a good idea at the time ....; just one of many.

[JoeyD]

Bm, I have not done that yet. That is my next test. I do have a question about negative pressure. If there is no fuel in the reservoir where the float is would that cause the pump to be pulling air and in turn keep the fuel from flowing? It is puzzling that it just seemed to stop working all of a sudden. I got a new pump and tried it as well but no luck.
Larrbeard, that is exactly how it happened. But she was coming home from this time and wanted the smooch...lol

[bmorgil]

There are valves in the pump that only allow a one way flow, allowing pressure to build on on the output side. The only thing I can think of that would mess it up is a leak on the suction side. If it was a big enough leak it could keep the vacuum so low on the suction side that the pump wont draw. Does the pump get gravity fed from the tank? If it isn't gravity fed from the tank and there is an air leak, it may not pull the fuel from the tank.

[LarrBeard]

"I got a new pump and tried it as well but no luck."

If my memory hasn't totally left me, we have recently had another incident of a "new" pump that didn't work.

[bmorgil]

It definitely seems like fuel pumps have been the hot topic!

[JoeyD]

Well folks there you have it. Another instance where a "new" pump was no good. My old pump had a leak that was keeping it from getting enough vacuum. I replaced with the "new" one, but that one was even worse off. So I went back today, got a good pump and there you have it. Put that one on and wouldn't you know, plenty of suction and I barely even had to choke it. Started right up and running like it's old self again.

I am not complaining that I replaced replaced line, cause it probably needed it. But man the diagnosis was tricky. That carb rebuild was probably not necessary, but I'm gonna keep all my old parts, clean them up and spare parts is never bad right?

Thanks for all the help on this one, I needed that guidance before I started replacing everything. I know better, but sometimes I just need some logic thrown at me.

[JoeyD]

88848885
Just a couple pics of the seat I made from the old canopy it was originally sitting under. The Texas wind destroyed it, so I repurchased the piping, got the vinyl material and some seat cushions from Hobby Lobby. That old ammo box my mom found in a barn. I bolted it on the top of the fender well.

[LarrBeard]

"Well folks there you have it. Another instance where a "new" pump was no good. "

The good news is that you got your early Christmas present. It runs now.

One of the Rules of Jeep is:

"Trust nothing that anyone tells you or that you read until you verify it yourself."

This usually applies to a whole vehicle, but in this case, it applied to a fuel pump. Somebody told you it was a "new, good pump." You trusted them, but when you verified it with your own eyes .. the truth came out.

We've seen this with distributors, carburetors, fuel pumps and master cylinders and probably more than that.

It is frustrating - but doesn't it feel good when you finally whip the problem?

[LarrBeard]

The ammo box is a touch of class ...

[bmorgil]

I like the ammo box for sure! It is in great shape. Way to use everything you have Joey! Very resourceful.

[JoeyD]

LarrBeard, you are absolutely right...Christmas came early. And it certainly feels good to correct a problem. Hopefully that means I can ask the wifey for other things for it now. Mom got like a half dozen of those boxes and some larger ones too. Hopefully I can find something to do with the others.

Bm, the point of this whole project was to take what I was given and stay true to it as close as possible. Then I began to realize that the undertaking of bringing this back to 1946 was going to take way more money than necessary to have a usable vehicle. So I started the journey of making this a custom CJ2A that attempts to do what any shade tree person might have done with the things available to them. I will continue to tweak what I need to and turn out a piece of history that will bring joy to me and those that come after me. Maybe a full on factory restoration will come later when time and resources permit.

[gmwillys]

I agree with you wholeheartedly. Build you the Jeep that you can enjoy the way you want to use it. I like my Heep because I have no issues driving it through the brush or mud. Maybe some day I'll splash some paint on and make it pretty, but not today.

[JoeyD]

gmwillys, i have always liked the look of your old Heep. I feel the same way about taking mine to the trails and eventually retiring it to farm and hunting use once my time in the service is over. My dream is that every child and grandchild will have a chance to ride in him.

[LarrBeard]

"I'll splash some paint on and make it pretty,"

No! NO! NOOOOOOO!

The Heep is what it is .....

[gmwillys]

No paint in the foreseeable future. I don't want to change the license plate, so it will have to stay a Heep.

[JoeyD]

Just checking in folks. And I agree with LarrBeard, no paint for the Heep. I have made a few additions but nothing crazy just yet. I am working on the windshield frame right now but probably won't finish till after the holidays. I have all of the pieces cut and the hinge bolted to the bottom. I have to invest in welder to complete the build, but it is something I should have in the shop anyhow. I will be learning on the fly for the most considering my last go with welding was about 15 years ago. I will post some pics of the project to see what y'all think before I put it all together. Only thing I think I still need to figure out are the latches at the top to hold it tight.

Oh yeah...on my daily drive to the gym this morning I had a trans hiccup. Looks like I am stuck in 2nd gear. Everything worked fine as I pulled out of the house and then bam, when I pulled into the parking nothing but second gear. I have had a little fluid leak but nothing crazy. So I am gonna pull the top off and see what is going on in there. I have already changed the fluid once, and it was bad. So now maybe it is just time to do it again, orrr I have lost too much fluid. I am hoping the former and not the latter of course.

[bmorgil]

JoeyD are you saying the stick wont move out of second gear, or there is no shift when you move the stick out of second gear?

[gmwillys]

A welder is a great addition to any shop. In my opinion, I recommend that you would look into a 110 volt MIG welder, but a solid core wire unit with a 75/25 argon bottle. It is a whole lot easier to learn on gas then a flux core wire. Maybe Santa will bring you a new unit to learn on.

Hopefully when you pull the trans cover off, you'll find something simple like a shift fork is stuck on the slide in the top cover.

[JoeyD]

bmorgil, I am saying that the stick won't move out of 2nd gear. Like I said it was really strange to just happen with no indication of an issue.

gmwillys, that is what I am hoping for. I am not sure that I want to worry with gas though. I was looking at a 110 Flux and figuring I would do my best to learn with that. I do have limited space and anything I get will have to move with me at least 2 more times. Thanks for the information though, I will check into everything before I make the purchase for sure.

[51 CJ3]

I am a novice welder at best but I have learned flux core splatters bad. I am running a Miller Multimatic and had been using flux core because the bottle was on my TIG machine. I was repairing gas caddies and decided I wanted the gas for shielding to help not go BOOM. It surprised me how big of a difference it made in quality and cleanliness of my welds. Flux core is nice where the bottle is very inconvenient to use but I am now a firm believer in using the shielding gas when possible.

[bmorgil]

Jeff, if the stick wont pull out of second gear I am hoping for a fairly easy one here. About the only thing that can cause that is a broken/out of position poppet spring or, interlock or wear on the detents in the rails causing the rails in the cover to lock out. I think a cover rebuild is in order.

[JoeyD]

bmorgil, I was hoping for at the most the same thing. However, I took the top off last night and it just seems bad to me...not an expert here by any means though. One of the sychronizer shift plates was pushed up out and not seated inside the synchronizer assembly. I could remove it and I attempted to put it back in place but the assembly would not slide back. I also noticed that my hands had gold metal shavings on them after touching the gears. You guys think an overhaul is in order? I really have no way of knowing when or if this has ever been done. Plus, I am really not sure that I want to tackle that by myself for the first time. Thoughts, recommendations...

[bmorgil]

JoeyD can you get a picture up close? I am not so sure there is a problem in the box just yet, but there certainly could be. The gold shavings are brass from the synchronizing cones. Not being there I just cant tell if it is an issue or not. It is possible the sychro locks have popped out or broke. A few things could be going on. Does the shifter move freely with the cover on the bench?

[TJones]

It sounds like either one of the shift plates lost the ear off the end that holds it on the spring let go or the spring broke.

[bmorgil]

Definitely could be it TJ. If the cover shifts fine on the bench, it could have lost a plate (lock key) from the clutch hub in the synchronizer assembly. That would prevent a shift no question. That is the only thing about that T90 synchronizer. Those three parts (Synchronizer spring, Synchronizer plate, hub) are fragile and the springs are not very strong.

[JoeyD]

Sorry y'all, I have been out traveling for the holidays and am just now getting back home. I will get a few pictures this afternoon and put them up here. I think y'all are on the right track here after talking to my stepdad and his mechanic a little bit. I just don't know how comfortable I feel about taking that box off and fixing it myself. I have seen and been quoted anywhere from $500-$1200 to rebuild the box. I would hate to do the whole thing if it is just the synchronizer plates or the spring, but maybe that is just the better option going forward anyhow.

[bmorgil]

The synchro isn't coming out to be repaired without completely disassembling the transmission. If it has a lot of miles on it, I think it would be wise to just get it rebuilt Joey.

[JoeyD]

Borgia I think you are probably right. I am doing some more inspection now and it appears the springs are either broken or past their use. The synchronizer just keeps pushing the plates out and they won't allow the assembly to come out of gear. Here are a few pics, not sure they are that clear but you can see that I removed one of the plates with just a pair of pliers.899089918992

[LarrBeard]

Uhhh....

I think you got all of the good out of that box.

[51 CJ3]

I would guess the bearings are shot with as much corrosion as I see in those pictures. My transfer case was in the same condition as the transmission.

[JoeyD]

Oh man...so you are both saying I should probably just cut the losses here and do a complete overhaul or drop in a new one altogether. I did find while I was in there that at least one plate was broken. That is keeping them from staying in place when shifting out of 2nd. I did move it out by hand with some magic fingers, so I am in neutral now. Thanks for the advice y'all. I guess I know what the next move is going to be.

[bmorgil]

The picture of the shifter boot tells a story. When that boot fails water runs right into the transmission. Jeff is pointing out the signs of water corrosion inside the box. You really don't know what it will take until you tear it down and see what is usable and what is not. Usually the water lays in the bottom of the box and destroys the lower bearings and their surfaces on the shafts and gears. In a worst case scenario you could end up replacing everything. The worst thing I have seen people do is put new bearings on pitted and corroded mating parts. I have seen many people replace the syncrho because it is jumping out of gear or not shifting , only to find the mating gear teeth are worn to badly to keep it in gear. The good news is all the parts are available.

Too bad your not close by Joey, about 30 minutes with that box is all it takes to disassemble and see how bad it is. You may want to try this place. I have read others recommending him. I do not have any experience with Herm but, he certainly shows up in the forums. Just remember there are no extra parts in his price. As he goes through the rebuild he will let you know how many extra parts you will need. The parts get expensive quickly.

http://hermtheoverdriveguy.com/t-90-rebuild-kit-90

[JoeyD]

Alright then...I am starting to decide why not just go for it and do the tear-down myself and see what I got. My real worry is actually getting the box and case off without messing something up. I believe I can do the overhaul, just a matter of getting it back on without causing more problems. I will keep y'all posted. That kit from herm looks like it just adds the plates and springs where the one from Kaiser doesn't include them. I would still just retain my old synchronizer assembly I believe and rebuild it.

https://www.kaiserwillys.com/category/overhaul-kits/transmission-overhaul-kits/minor-transmission-overhaul-kit-fits-46-71-jeep-willys-with-t-90-transmission

[bmorgil]

When it comes to that synchro, I would replace it as an assembly complete. You don't know how worn the cones are on the inside and that is where they wear. For the price the synchro assembly new is a good deal.

https://www.kaiserwillys.com/transmission-synchronizer-assembly-fits-46-71-jeep-willys-with-t-90-transmission

Be sure to read this post from the tech section this forum. There is a mistake in the way the tear down information is out there. It is important to remove the idler shaft correctly. The Rick Stivers guide is a great resource. That one mistake will cause you a lot of headaches however. The rest of the guide is great. You can do some damage if you follow the identified mistake procedure.

https://willysjeepforum.kaiserwillys.com/showthread.php?2885-T90-Teardown-Important-Correction-to-Rick-Stivers-Guide

[LarrBeard]

OK.

Take a deep breath.

You can do this. There are a lot of people around to help you and to point you in the right direction. Take a lot of pictures. Ask questions. Don't hit things with anything bigger that a 2-pound hammer unless you know that's what you need.

Doc Dana (BMorgil) won't lead you astray --- he's a lot more trustworthy than he looks.

[bmorgil]

Doc Dana (BMorgil) won't lead you astray --- he's a lot more trustworthy than he looks.

Hahahahahahah!!!!! This is why we love LarrBeard! He will wait a long time to get you back. Nice Larry! ya gotta love a great shot!

I don't think you can get into much trouble here, at least not something that cant be fixed. The actual trans work has a lot of support out there. Follow the Rick Stivers guide (watching out for the one mistake) and you will do great. The individual bearings can be challenging but there are three "tricks" to help you there. New caged style bearings, the sticky grease and a stick method and finally the one I use, a simple rubber band. Google up the videos (there are several) and print out Rick's guide and read it as you go. The service manual will walk you right through the transmission removal. I like to pull the transfer case and transmission as a unit. Support the back of the engine and disconnect a few things, and it comes out fairly well. Going back in is a mater of the alignment tool that came with your clutch and a good jack that rolls easily and holds everything solid.

As my good friend Larry said, we will help you if we can. It can be hard communicating the how to when all we can do is write each other, but we are certainly up for the try.

[TJones]

Here you go Joe, this is what I started with on mine and a picture of the rubber band trick bmorgil was talking about from the “Rick Stivers YouTube Videos”

89978998

[LarrBeard]

I didn't rebuild my own transmission on the '48 truck (it is basically a three-on-the-tree version of the same transmission) and I regret not doing it.

After three passes through it, it still has a hitch going from first to second (Doc Dana has diagnosed it as a synchro problem) but I've chosen to live with it vs. pulling it and doing it a fourth time.

If you do it yourself, it will get done right.

[JoeyD]

Alright, so I started the removed today and I have everything disconnected. There is one thing that I cannot find anywhere. It appears to be a rubber hose that runs out of the transfer case. As you can see from the pics I have some serious leaking problems. I have it supported by a jack as y'all suggested just gonna let the wife help tomorrow so I have an extra set of hands. I did get to that top driver's side bolt alot easier than I expected. 90789079908090819082

[gmwillys]

The rubber hose is the speedometer cable. If you haven't already, pull the two bolts in the frame for the clutch pivot. There are spring loaded cups that apply pressure to the pivot ball mounts on the frame and on the transmission.

[JoeyD]

GM, gotcha that makes sense. I just hadn't screwed it off far enough, but I got it. Yeah I had to take that clutch arm off all the way in order to get the transmission out. I did not take the the transfer case shifters off so I had to do some serious maneuvering. Luckily I had the wife under the helping me get it out. Y'all can see it is pretty nasty cause that transfer case is doing some serious leaking. I am gonna do the fix myself and the probably have someone put it back in for me. 9091909290939094

[bmorgil]

Looking good Joey your on your way now. You don't want to try to put it back in? You seem to be doing fine with it.

[JoeyD]

Bmorgil, I cannot emphasis enough the pain it was laying under that thing with my wife and maneuvering it out. Granted, I am sure it is much easier with ALL of the shifter levers unattached but that thing is not light. Perhaps I will change my mind once I get it put back together...lol We will see what happens, love her to death but I need a little more muscle under there next time.

[bmorgil]

Joey, rent or buy a jack that rolls. I take the unit out assembled to the transfer case and re-install it the same way. As long as you have a concrete slab to roll the jack on it should take a lot of the muscle out of it. You want to rent a floor jack with a transmission adapter on it or, get a transmission jack. You fasten the clutch assembly to the flywheel with an alignment tool in place to simulate the transmission input. Then you fasten the transfer case transmission and cross member assembly to the jack. Raise it all to the right height and slide it in. Get the vehicle in the air securely on jack stands, high enough to be able to roll the jack with the assembly in place under the vehicle. keep the shift levers off until the unit is in place and you start to raise it. Then install the transfer case shift levers and finish raising it to position and push it into the clutch assembly. Once you have it secured and in, install the cover on the transmission. Refer to your shop manual for the process to install the clutch with the alignment tool.

https://www.harborfreight.com/450-lb-low-lift-transmission-jack-61232.html

[51 CJ3]

I have one of those harbor freight jacks. It works okay. The transmission will not clear the frame when on the jack. I have 31” tires and the front end is on jack stands.

[JoeyD]

Alright Bmorgil, you have convinced me to attempt it myself. I will make sure that the Mrs. knows we can do this...lol Just so happens that my Harbor Freight here has one of those on hand as well. So I guess we will get that and give her a go. That clutch alignment tool will be a must cause that is what I am most concerned about. I will let y'all know how the rebuild it going too.

On another note, I have my windshield frame fabricated and put together. Just have to take it to the glass shop to get them to put a piece in. Hoping they can put a rubber gasket around it as well, but if not I believe I will do that to make it a little more rigid and flush on the roll cage. I will post some pics of that project later.

[bmorgil]

The clutch tool should come with the clutch plate and disc. If not you will need one. They are not expensive. Usually made of plastic, you can find them pretty cheap sometimes.

https://www.kaiserwillys.com/willys-clutch-alignment-tool-fits-41-71-jeep-willys

[JoeyD]

So are you saying that while I am in there I should replace that too? Or depending on how it looks? I know I got some bad leaking on that transfer case too, i'm gonna have to at the least replace all those seals and gaskets right?

[bmorgil]

It would be a very good idea to replace the clutch while you are there. It s important to have the flywheel resurfaced when installing a new clutch. You want a good fresh flat surface for the new clutch.The transfer case will definitely need all new seals and gaskets.

[51 CJ3]

Check the yokes for wear where the seals ride. It’s not gonna do much good to replace those seals if the parts have grooves. The yokes can be sleeved or replaced.

[JoeyD]

Bmorgil, alright I will plan to do that as well. Plus making sure to get the flywheel resurfaced as too.

Jeff, good call on those yokes as well.

Gonna start tearing things down this evening probably. Supposed to get some weather here tonight, so maybe I will get some free time tomorrow as well...lol I am really starting to believe that I will be doing more than I first expected when it comes to repairs. There is plenty of life left in the old guy but it really needs some attention.

[LarrBeard]

Just take a lot of pictures ... there will be something that the book just doesn't show exactly where it came from.

[JoeyD]

It is looking pretty bad folks. I'm not sure much of anything is reusable. Granted I still haven't done any cleaning, but it is bad. Don't worry about the makeshift table I have it on...lol But y'all were right, it wasn't really bad at all taking it apart. Here are the pics while I decide what to do.9105910691079108

[TJones]

JoeyD it is not as bad as you are thinking, all the bearings/races/syncros can be replaced, the seals and gaskets are replaceable and as far as the gears go if it doesn't have a broken tooth, hardfacing wore off of it or a gouge out of it I would just clean the up with a wire wheel or a scotch bright pad and putter back in.
Those T90's are a very forgiving tranny, depending what your intentions are for the project for example if you are planning on setting a new land speed record at the Bonneville Salt Flats in Utah I would replace everything or maybe even adding 35 more gears but I am sure that's not your plan but if you're just planning on short little one tank trips around town once and a while I would just replace only what's needed or broke.
That's just my opinion, but I am CHEAP :):)

[bmorgil]

Clean it up well Joey and take close up pictures of any parts that show wear or concern you. We will be glad to take a look. A little rust on the gears wont hurt. Its like Tim said, chips signs of excessive wear on gear teeth (especially gear clutching teeth) and wear or pitting on bearing surfaces are what you are looking for. Replace the synchronizer assembly. For what it cost there is no sense messing around with them. It will need all new seals, gaskets and bearings at the very least.

[JoeyD]

Great to hear that from y'all. The way Rick talked if it isn't prestigious, replace it. But I could have been misinterpreting for sure. Definitely bearing need replaced and the synchronizer was already on the list. I tore down the transfer case today too and it looks way better. Even the bearings look to be in good shape. I am still gonna replace all the seals and gaskets though. Hopefully a good cleaning and this will all be good to go. I will keep y'all posted. TJones, yeah if I was going for records I would have just replaced the whole thing...lol

911491159116

[TJones]

91179118

You are right there the transfer case doesn’t look as bad as the tranny Joey!!!
Once you get it all apart you think to yourself WTF did I get myself into, but it’s not nearly as bad as it looks :):)

[JoeyD]

TJones, yeah I had that exact feeling. I have a bunch of pieces in the garage and I am sure the Mrs. is wondering when it will get put back together...lol I still have some cleaning to do, but only because I am so meticulous about it. I got my parts in and I should have some free time this weekend to get it put back together. I will shoot y'all the finished product. Thanks for all of the words of advise and encouragement.

[TJones]

Seriously it isn't as bad as it looks, Rick does a pretty good job walking you through the re-assembly of both.
Bmorgil did mention in one of his replies about something you really need to pay close attention too (Rick was not actually right on what he said) and I for the life of me cannot remember where it was or what it was about but I am sure Bmorgil will check in later and remind us all on what it was, that's why they call him Dr. Dana on here. I guess after a lifetime of working there and retiring you kinda deserve the respect!!!

[bmorgil]

TJ you are too kind. There is indeed a correction required on Rick's guide.

https://willysjeepforum.kaiserwillys.com/showthread.php?2885-T90-Teardown-Important-Correction-to-Rick-Stivers-Guide

[51 CJ3]

I didn’t have any trouble taking the T-90 apart. I don’t recall watching any videos (very rare for me due to poor internet service) or reading a manual but, if I did, it would have been the original service manual or the military service manual. I do remember wondering how I was going to reinstall the oil shield. It didn’t just fall out and I didn’t see a path to putting it back. I am still tinkering with the front axle so I don’t know when I will get back to the transmission. When the time comes I will seek help if I need it.

[bmorgil]

No problem if you need help Jeff, we will try if we can!

[JoeyD]

Bmorgil, I have made sure to take a look at that correction you put in the Tech Info for sure. I have also been taking some time looking over most of the stuff you have put up on there. I have also watched Rick's over and again several times to catch anything I might have missed. Lucky me I have TV in the garage and I throw it up there and go step back step, pausing with I need to. I also found another video on disassembly and reassembly of the D18 Transfer Case as well.

TJ, it didn't seem that hard taking mine apart either as soon as I got done with some troublesome nuts and bolts. The inside came apart fairly easily and I am hoping to just take my time and put it back together fairly easy as well.

[bmorgil]

Love that T.V. in the garage! I do the same thing... pop it up on the T.V. and work to the video.

[JoeyD]

Transfer case is complete. It cleaned up really nice and I am pretty proud of the finished product. I have to get a new yoke nut cause one of mine was boogered up pretty bad. Other wise it went together fairly easily. After cleaning up the T90 I have decided there are a couple gears I should replace. So I am gonna wait till those come in to compete that. All in all though it cleared up nice too. Here are a few pics and I'll post the transmission when it is complete. 917091719172

[LarrBeard]

That is really a good looking job.

But, don't be disappointed or surprised if you have some drips or drops around a seal or two once you get oil back in it - that 's just about par for the course.

It is not unusual to find a groove or burr that you missed when you tore it down...

But - Great Job!

[gmwillys]

Looking good JoeyD!

[TJones]

You are on the back nine of getting her back together now JoeyD!!!

[bmorgil]

Looking read to run Joey!

[JoeyD]

LarrBeard, I understand that. But I can't promise that it won't still irritate me a little bit. Really appreciate the kind words. Thanks to the rest of y'all too. I went ahead and ordered a couple of replacements parts for the transmission as well. They should be here this week and hopefully I can get that put back together this weekend. I need to make some tools to do that job as well to make things easier as Rick mentioned. I am certainly ready to get back behind the wheel of it.

[TJones]

This may be a good investment Joey for your D18 rear yoke if you don't already have it together and are in doubt about the rear yoke leaking.
I bought this double lipped seal and speedy sleeve for mine when I had it all apart and put it in bc the rear yoke had a groove wore in it from the original seal.

91759176

[JoeyD]

Alright folks, I know it has been a while but not cause nothing has been done. I will post the pics later tonight when I get to the house.

So I got everything back together without too much hassle and it is was a bit simpler than I expected. Which is a good thing right?! Anyhow, I do have to admit that I received some developing information from the Mrs. Things have gotten serious as you could say, yep at 40 years old I am gonna be a dad again. So needless to say, I have been a little busy with other things...lol That being said, I was not putting my now pregnant wife under, over, or on top of the trans/transfer case to help wrestle that think back in there. So I took down to a shop that said they could do it for a reasonable price, or so I thought. After 3 weeks of waiting I have found that I might have listened to you about this and maybe enlisted some other help to just do it myself. It is finished but at double the price because of it being "a learning experience". And apparently I have a leak, but we all kind of expected as much. So I should pick it up on Monday at the latest and go from there.

On a good note, I did get my windshield completely finished and honestly I basically did all the fabrication myself. The only thing I really outsourced was the glass that I had someone cut for me. So that is complete and just wanting to be installed once I get it back to the house.

Bottom line, lessons learned on one project for not doing myself while at the same time fully completing another that I expected to need assistance with. Can't wait to get it back cause summer is here in Texas and it needs to be on the road.

[bmorgil]

CONGRATULATIONS!!!!! A new baby, that is awesome news. You need to get that Jeep going for the baby picnics.

[gmwillys]

Way to go Joey! Congratulations on the baby and the Jeep progress.

[JoeyD]

Well here is the windshield. I am honestly really impressed with myself. I did not expect it to turn out so well. Just one more bracket and it will be fully mounted. Looking for some rubber pieces to reinforce the brackets. Other than that I will mount some blocks on the hood for a more original look. Gonna have to push the leak investigation to next weekend. But I know one leak is on the rear yoke and the other one looks fairly easy to find.9387

[bmorgil]

Looking good Joey!

[JoeyD]

Alright folks, I am back. It has been a wild year or so. When I left there was some happy news and unfortunately some very tragic things happened. Life gives you challenges and you overcome. So, that is all I am going to say about that.

I have since moved to north Alabama and to be honest am much happier here and out of Texas. I finally got the rig here just before Christmas and am starting the process of seeing how much damage the sitting has caused. First, fuel is an issue at this point. The inside of my pump was covered in white powder, so I went ahead and replaced that. I have checked all the lines and replaced the filter, but to no avail. The new pump just ain't pumping it seems. I have primed it, and pulled fuel through the line...the old fashioned way, not enjoyable as we all know. I just can't seem to get this one figured out. Unless, that new pump just doesn't work either. I have read about them and that is possible. The new pumps that get manufactured just don't come out to the specs they are supposed to. Plus, it isn't even the orginal glass bulb type...but it is the same pump that would fit on all our Jeeps up to about 71.

I may catch some flak for this but it is what I decided to go ahead and do. I purchased the electic fuel pump kit from Kaiser that deletes the orginal mechnical one. Alright, now bring on the words of wisdom that I know you all have.

[bmorgil]

JoeyD! Glad your back! Alabama is one of my favorite states. It has it all that's for sure, and warm Southern Hospitality.

Man I am betting you got a bad fuel pump. If it is it will be the third one I have heard about in the last year.

The electric fuel pump from KW is a TSP (Top Street Performance) micro pump. It has an operating pressure of 2 to 3.5 psi. It needs to be gravity fed. Make sure it is lower than the tank. They can be a little noisy and you can help that with some rubber under the mount. It should work great for you. Be sure to remove the mechanical pump and use the block off plate. The electric pump allows you to install a hidden switch to help deter thieves if you wish.

[JoeyD]

Bm...You are correct about that. It was one of the first things my wide mentioned and she is still getting used to all of the peopling...lol

I am going to take that one back and exchange it anyhow. The KW kits allows you to swap back pretty easy if you want to. Plus, I have alot about people running both.

I was certainly planning to put that as low as possible and removing the mechanical one. The kit comes with the block off plate as well.

Thanks for the wisdom as always and I will be back to let yall know how it goes. There are a couple of other things I can tinker with till the part comes in.

[bmorgil]

Good to hear Alabama is good for you all!

I would not run the mechanical pump and the electric pump at the same time. I would use the block off with the electric pump. If the diaphragm in the mechanical pump fails (they all eventually do), The pressure from the electric pump can quickly fill the crankcase with fuel. I have seen posts on forums where people do it. I don't believe it is a good idea. Fuel mixed with the oil will wipe out the bearings in a short period of time.

[gmwillys]

Welcome to Alabama Joey. The peopling is something one would have to get used to.

[JoeyD]

Gotcha BM, that is what I was thinking too. I am going to do just as you have mentioned.

GM, we really love it here. Got us a little piece of land outside of Huntsville, with a few animals. I'm teaching my city girl how to country. I also got a nice big garage now, so all of this Jeep maintenance can happen out of the weather.

[gmwillys]

Huntsville is a nice area, with plenty to do. When you get a chance, I highly recommend the Veteran's Museum in Huntsville. They have a lot of equipment stuffed into a fairly small building. Also, if you are up for an off road weekend, in June the Georgia Jeep Alliance has a weekend ride at Morris Mountain ORV park in Delta, AL. The weekend is a benefit that donates proceeds to Veteran causes. The girls and I are planning to bring the Heep out for it again this year.

https://georgiajeepallianceclub.com/jeep-invasion/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhpEPm6HAME

[bmorgil]

Now that sounds like a good time gm!

[gmwillys]

The stock friendly ride through the mountainside is pretty nice. There is only a couple spots that are slightly tricky, but very manageable with no locker or lift.

[JoeyD]

That sounds great GM. I will definitely look into being there.

I got the new electric pump in however, there is always another catch. In the time that I was waiting on the part, I decided to do a little more tinkering on my setup. I kept the pump hooked up to the tank and manually pumped some fuel through the thing. Wouldn't you know, it started pumping. So I replaced some line and the connector on the outlet side of the old pump and away it went. I have plenty of pressure and fuel. The old guy is running like a top and really even the cold doesn't seem to bother it much. So I am going to keep the new electric pump on the shelf for now and run it as is.

I have a clutch issue to work on now, but other than that things are looking good for now.

[bmorgil]

Good news there Joey! I prefer the mechanical pump on them.

[gmwillys]

Good to hear that you are up and running again.