1st Time Jeep Owner

[bmorgil]

I adjust the "Million" way down for depreciation, of my bones. "It's just a few hundred bucks dear."

[Catlewis]

Ordered a set of factory style steps + a set of chrome headlight trim rings. Supposed to deliver tomorrow.........

[bmorgil]

I have the headlight rings and steps from KW. They are good stuff.

[LarrBeard]

I bought headlight rings from KW - very nice.

I also bought steps for the'48 truck. They looked like inverted cake pans and we sent them back. The edges were way too rounded off - so we reworked the originals.

"It's just a few more dollars to do it right, dear."

[Catlewis]

The step kits are terrible quality. No instructions provided with the kit and no fasteners for attachment to the vehicle. This jeep didn't have any steps when I bought it therefore I'll have to "re-engineer" these.

[bmorgil]

I don't have the same ones you use on the 65', but I have the instructions for the ones on the early Jeep's. My Jeep did not come with steps originally. The kit I received from KW a few years ago was a good reproduction of the factory kit, and had the original installation instructions reprinted with them.

Here is a link that might help you. https://www.jeepforum.com/threads/need-cj5-factory-side-step-install-location.1476799/

[Catlewis]

All of the brakes are installed {finally}. Several of the poor quality "new" pins broke as I attempted to install them, had to re-use some of the old hardware. This Jeep was amazingly original, still had origianl hardware stamped with a "W". Even the wheel bearings are "Timkin" made in USA.1102611027110281102911029

[gmwillys]

I harp on using original steel where you can, and this is a prime example.

[bmorgil]

Agreed gm! If the original stuff can be used, it can be very difficult to find something better. In the case of those Timken Bearings, they are still available from Tmken (though they may no longer be made in the USA).

[Catlewis]

Started working on the grille assembly. Anyone know a source for the fabric weather seal and fasteners located on top of grille assembly (between grille and hood). Third photo.
110311103211033

[bmorgil]

Walks 4x4 used to have it so I bet a call to Mike at KW will find a kit. Here is a place just in case.

https://stores.partsdude4x4.net/grill-to-hood-welting-cj5-cj2a-cj3a/

(https://stores.partsdude4x4.net/grill-to-hood-welting-cj5-cj2a-cj3a/)Google "jeep grill welting kit", and you will get a few choices and tools for the rivets.

[Catlewis]

Grille finished. Painted, assembled, and installed.1118411185

[bmorgil]

That thing is looking great!

[56willys]

Looks good indeed! That mack bulldog will intimidate any JK you pass on the trail!

[gmwillys]

Looking good!

[bmorgil]

That mack bulldog will intimidate any JK you pass on the trail!

I love the "Doggie"! Every Jeep needs some form of personal signature.

[Catlewis]

Mack Bull Dog was on the Jeep when I bought it and originally I intended removing it, however our 2 year old grand daughter has taken a shine to it. Every time she enters the garage, first thing her eyes search for is that bull dog, and she's not happy unless you pick her up so she can actually touch it. Hood ornaments are not my style, however it is rather ironic that my grandfather's last few vehicles (he passed back in the early 70's) had a Mack Bull Dog on the hood. He moved it from one vehicle to the next. Somehow I ended up with his Mack Bull Dog and I've kept it all these years. Currently mounted on top of tool box lid....... Since this is a Tuxedo Park, I'm considering having the hood & windshield hinges re-chromed. If I follow thru with that, might toss the old bull dog in there for a fresh coating of chrome???

[TJones]

I agree Cat, Grandkids can make you do ANYTHING even if it's not your style or taste we have 8 total and they run PaPa ragged sometimes!!!

[Catlewis]

How do you say "no" to this? Wild hair and all. She's just one of two of "Pap's Girls".

11195

[bmorgil]

Hahaha! Love that hairdo. What a cutie pie..... she should be able to run you broke quickly!

[Catlewis]

Those two little girls are definitely going to have a negative impact on what their parents inherit!

[LarrBeard]

Then you get most of them in the Jeep!

That's what Old Jeeps are for.

[Catlewis]

Installed new rad, new hoses, thermostat and flushed the block with citric acid. After that was completed, filled with antifreeze and took for the first test drive since I bought it. Likely the first time it has been driven since 1985! I came away from this "event" with the mind slogan "wow, vehicles have made some major improvements since 1965"! It was like sitting inside a tin shed during a hail storm!

[bmorgil]

Hahahaha! They have come a very long way since 1965! Quiet is not what they were known for.

[Catlewis]

It was also immediately obvious the brakes need to be adjusted. So that will be the next thing. Jack each tire off the floor and turn the adjuster until shoes barely touch drum. Also appears there's a small brake fluid leak at one of the banjo bolts on the new dual reservoir master cylinder. The engine noise / sound is very reminiscent of a 1950's Ford Ferguson TO-30 tractor.

[gmwillys]

No radio needed with the whine of the 134.

[Catlewis]

"No radio needed with the whine of the 134",,,,,, You're correct! With 5.38 gears, 30 mph it sounds like a weedeater!

[LarrBeard]

"It was like sitting inside a tin shed during a hail storm!"

Yeah - I cheated when I put the '48 truck back together. I had the guy who did the upholstery put in carpets. The original was a jute backer with rubber mat - no sound or heat insulation at all.

The first time I took it back out - I thought the engine had died at the first stop light.

It still isn't "quiet" - but you can hear your wife talk to you when you are on the road. (No Comments!!!)

The big dirt grabber tires do whine a lot.

[bmorgil]

It still isn't "quiet" - but you can hear your wife talk to you when you are on the road. (No Comments!!!)

OK I am trying to leave it alone but..... wait, what? Did you mean you can hear your wife telling you what? Something about U.S. 24 and the Anthony Wayne Bridge directions perhaps? Maybe that truck got a little too quite Larry.....

[56willys]

Yep, a Willys will make you wonder... All it is is steel and some wood, how can it make this many different noises!?

Now ride in mine with busted U bolts. And a giant exhaust leek. Because the former owner put 2 inch pipe over the 1.5" at the manifold. without any clamp or sealer of any kind. It makes lots of weird NOISES!!!

Larry, you got the Cadillac model!!!

[gmwillys]

My bride makes sure I can hear what she has to say regardless, especially during the weather forecast on the news. She does like the whine of the Heep I, and Heep III. She's never heard Heep II yet, but she'll appreciate it too...Eventually.

[Catlewis]

Been toping off fluids on the Jeep before starting any major test driving. I'm looking for info on the Dana 44 rear axle regarding the grease fittings designed to apply lubrication to the rear wheel bearings. Some info suggests axles with these zerks also have a corresponding "vent" located directly above (on top of the axle tube). Mine does not. Now I realize it's possible they somehow were removed by previous owner (example; wrapping a tow chain around the axle) and the holes could be plugged shut. I can't feel anything with my hand, however that's not to say they're not plugged with dirt and painted over therefore it will require further investigation / removing the tires. My question is did they all have vents if they had zerks? #2. Are the vents still available anywhere?

[bmorgil]

Yes there are grease zerk points and a small and I mean small vent hole the grease Must be purged from to ensure a fully greased bearing. There is a post here somewhere. I'll look for it. The hole is drilled into the top of the axle tube right behind the backing plate flange. It is 1/16" in diameter. It is very, very hard to see. You pump in grease until you see a small stream of grease about the size of hair, come squirting out of the hole.

And of course the picture is sideways!

[Catlewis]

Appears some of the earlier designs used a little "pop-up" valve to indicate the cavity was filled with grease. Anyway, so it sounds like mine should have a small hole vs the pop-up design. Thanks so much for the info!

[Catlewis]

This thing must have 20 grease fittings (and I love that)! Filled both front closed knuckle joints and the steering box with John Deere corn head grease. Both rears got topped off with 90 / 140. Yes, I know that's thicker than what they call for however it wasn't refiling from empty, I was adding to existing who knows what. Also dumped the same thing in the T90 & transfer case. Anxious for a nice change in the weather to take it for another mile or two shakedown ride. Still need to get in there and adjust those brake shoes. Maybe tonight???

[bmorgil]

Catlewis, you should not put Hypoid Gear Axle lube in the transmission and transfer case. You do not want EP lubes in there at all. I would drain that all out and follow the guidance in the link below.

I am only aware of the hole that was drilled in the axle tube to relive the grease when purging. On Military vehicles, the hole had a pipe plug in it that had to be removed for purging. This was to allow the vehicle to submerge the axle tubes without getting water in. If there is anything else in those holes, someone put it there other than Dana or Willys.

https://willysjeepforum.kaiserwillys.com/showthread.php?2371-The-correct-lube-for-a-Jeep-synchronized-transmission

(https://willysjeepforum.kaiserwillys.com/showthread.php?2371-The-correct-lube-for-a-Jeep-synchronized-transmission)https://willysjeepforum.kaiserwillys.com/showthread.php?2513-T90-Transmission-and-Dana-18-Transfer-case-Lube-Levels

https://willysjeepforum.kaiserwillys.com/showthread.php?2559-Diagram-of-all-zerks-that-need-grease-on-an-M38A1&highlight=zerk

(https://willysjeepforum.kaiserwillys.com/showthread.php?2559-Diagram-of-all-zerks-that-need-grease-on-an-M38A1&highlight=zerk)https://willysjeepforum.kaiserwillys.com/showthread.php?2395-The-Correct-Grease-for-the-quot-Zerks-quot&highlight=zerk

[Catlewis]

The gear oil I used is Walmart brand "Supertech" 85w / 140w which is a GL5 rated lubricant. Product details for this specifically state: Protects against corrosion of copper and bronze bushings.

[Catlewis]

Bit the bullet and ordered a new windshield frame and gaskets......... Ouch!

[bmorgil]

Do not use GL5 in your Transmission Transfer case Catlewis. GL5 is for the Axles. Your Transmission and Transfercase require GL4. GL5 has way to much EP additives in it, and is far too thick.GL4 85/140 is a lot thinner. You are looking for the lube to be the consistency of a 40w motor oil. The mistake of Using GL5 in a vintage synchronized transmission happens a lot and even in the old days. Not many realize the importance of using the correct GL rating in these transmissions. A lot of service stations simply pumped the same "gear lube" in there, they were using in the axle. It definitely created a lot of warranty issues. Click on the link I posted for you below for more information.

https://willysjeepforum.kaiserwillys.com/showthread.php?2371-The-correct-lube-for-a-Jeep-synchronized-transmission

I cant wait to see how that windshield fits. It seems to be the toughest reproduction part to get to fit. Both TJones and I had a tough time with them.

[Catlewis]

NOVAK website specifically says: Hypoid gear oil is sulphurized higher than transmission oil and can be mildly corrosive to the non-ferrous alloys used for synchros, bushings and thrust washers in these transmissions. An 80w-90, API-GL5 or MT-1 rated fluid is very good.

[Catlewis]

What were the issues regarding fitment? Fame to hinge alignment or glass?

[56willys]

The service manual states GL-4 https://willysjeepforum.kaiserwillys.com/showthread.php?2394-53-71-Service-Manual-4-Wheel-Drive-CJ-3B-5-5A-6-6A-2-Wheel-Drive-DJ-5-DJ-6

Mine i filled up with stuff from Napa. It is for use as GL-5 or GL-4. Says it is specialy optimized for non synchro gear boxes. I know most things i read say to only use GL-4. However i have seen some people run GL-5.

[bmorgil]

Many people use GL5. It definitely doesn't make it right for all transmissions. There is more to this than chemical compatibility with the brass sychros. Some of today's GL5's are compatible with many metals, as many different metals are used today. Just because GL5 may state it is compatible with brass, does not indicate it will work correctly in your T84, T90 or T96. The biggest issue is the EP (extreme pressure) capability of GL5. Many mechanics and technicians today do not relate to the design of sychros in the 40's 50's 60's and 70's. The relative weight of GL5 is thicker than GL4. This also causes issues. Using a high EP (which is what GL5 is) causes a few issues with proper synchronizer to clutch collar interaction. I explained this further in the link I posted in the thread below, along with the damage it can cause. I can say that in the many transmissions I have torn down and rebuilt, and seen torn down and inspected for warranty, the ones that had the wrong lube were always easy to tell. The Jeep transmissions we are talking about were all designed for GL4 no mater what you read. Straight 40w motor oil also works well. GL5 is way to thick, especially when it gets cold. Any lube that meets a GL5 specification regardless of whether it is a combination GL4/GL5, will not be correct for the early Jeep trans. GL5 has too much EP and its too thick.

[bmorgil]

What were the issues regarding fitment? Fame to hinge alignment or glass?

All of it! On mine the "arms" had to be cut off and re-welded in the correct position, as the entire windshield was too far to the drivers side. The glass did not fit. It had to be ground down by a glazier.

[gmwillys]

As far as the windshield for a CJ5, there isn't too much issue with the windshield fitment, except maybe the cowl gasket may be a little too thick. Often times you may have to apply pressure with a ratchet strap to compress the seal enough to latch the windshield up. Definitely test fit the frame before installing the glass. The flat fenders are a bit fussier like Bmorgil said, often taking heat to bend the mount arms back into shape, or in his case cut off and repositioned.

[Catlewis]

Great info on the lubrication, horrible prognosis on the windshield however poor quality replacement parts seems to be par for the course on these old Jeeps. Last evening I didn't do much however did get the "4 Wheel Drive" stencil out and sprayed the tailgate.11241

[Catlewis]

Another potential project Jeep? or is it an express ticket to divorce court! Can anyone identify what this is? Military Jeep?11250

[56willys]

Appears to be a CJ2a. Since it has protruding headlights/turn signals. Not recessed. Also no grab handles on rear quarters. And it is semi floating rear not full float like military would be. Top of windshield fram looks like it's squared off so not a 3a.

It will need alot of welding. However looks pretty decent. It looks like it wants to be saved!

Hey, make it to be the wife's jeep then everyone's happy!

Edit, Also military would have split windshield.

[gmwillys]

56Willys looks to be right on the money. With the marker lights it appears to be a '47 or '48 2A. The earlier '46s had inset bullet marker lamp assemblies versus the bulb socket and lens. One more Jeep in the fleet never hurt anyone.... yet.

[56willys]

56Willys looks to be right on the money.

Hey, this is a rare occasion for me. haha

Good eye, I missed the marker lights.

[Catlewis]

He says, "ONE MORE JEEP IN THE FLEET NEVER HURT ANYONE" as he eases back on the couch and grabs a bag of popcorn!

[Catlewis]

Stopped last evening on the drive home and ordered an antique license for the Jeep. At least now I won't have to look over my shoulder during test drives. Windshield frame has been put on back order till mid March. Right now the biggest issue is the brakes. Must be air in the system because everything is new (including a dual master, all wheel cylinders, hard & soft lines, and shoes.

[bmorgil]

If you are sure you have all the air out, don't disregard the new master cylinder. Seems to be a rash of those lately that are defective.

[gmwillys]

I'm just lucky, the wife doesn't mind if I drag things home.

Like Bmorgil said, this seems to be a disturbing trend for brake systems. There are no American made brake manufactures left. Raybestos was the last one that I knew of, and you can find them advertised on Rock Auto, but everything is out of stock.

[Catlewis]

Ordered replacement windshield frame and was told it would be backordered until mid March,,,,,,,,, received an email this AM informing me it will be delivered tomorrow!

[gmwillys]

Well, that's a pleasant surprise.... Hopefully it shows up then. I bought a rear seat from Dead Jeeps for the YJ, and the tracking provided kept saying it was to be delivered on such and such a day, then it would get extended to the next day. That went on for a week before I called the company directly to find out that they had already sold the particular seat prior to me buying it. I did receive my full refund, and they won't have to be looking for me to buy anything else from them.

[51 CJ3]

I screwed up years ago. I turned in my original brake master cylinder in to NAPA for a core. Got back a foreign piece of junk that didn’t quite fit the mount holes. It works but it has always bothered me. The plunger had pushed through the piston. I should have seen if I could repair it. Or possibly make my own piston.

[bmorgil]

I have one from KW. I had good luck with it so far. They will take it back no question if it is defective. You may want to try a KW if it is your master giving you trouble. I have seen some master cylinders advertised on EBay that were worked over in India. You don't know what your going to get now a days. If you buy it from KW, at least if its junk they will keep working with you till its right.

[51 CJ3]

I have bought a lot from KW. I agree about them having good customer service although I get better technical support in this forum.

[gmwillys]

I installed some Crown brand of wheel cylinders and master cylinder on our 2A, and the only issue I had was that the wheel cylinder mount holes didn't come close to lining up with the backer plate. Other than that, they are all still working alright after a number of years. I buy from a few trusted sources but will say that KW is my go-to for most everything just because of the good customer service.

[bmorgil]

I have bought a lot from KW. I agree about them having good customer service although I get better technical support in this forum.

The Tech support on this Forum is great. The members on this Forum share experiences without reserve. The good the bad and the ugly, unafraid to show our screw ups! We learn a ton from each other. There is a lot of good and bad info out there, and there are links in the posts to some of the other great Forums. Support on all things that's for sure, from rebuilding a vintage jeep to welding to tools to DIY, what ever! Even some life experiences and "Dead Goat Stories".

KW had a great idea with this Forum. They provide us with all the help and support we need to keep posting a lot of good stuff on here. A special thanks to them for the Forum! I think their hope is, we all are here if they need a pick up on the tech side of it!

[LarrBeard]

"Even some life experiences and "Dead Goat Stories".

Noooo - not the dead goat again!

[bmorgil]

And just like that......

https://willysjeepforum.kaiserwillys.com/showthread.php?2749-Ham-s-48-The-Dead-Goat/page2

[56willys]

Wow Larry, what a story! Don't go putting any goats in the 48! It's amazing what willys guys will do for the right parts.

[gmwillys]

The goat story rides again! It's about time!

We do go to great lengths to find parts, that's for sure. Not all new parts are junk, but with Chrysler/Fiat owning the licensing for Willys/Kaiser/AMC parts, we can only get what we can get. KW does a fantastic job in trying to supply us with the best quality parts available. The sheet metal piece parts that they sell are American made.

When you start a project, you become a hoarder of extra parts when they become available.

[56willys]

I'm right there with you Gmwillys. Local junkyard had it, and I couldn't let it get melted down into tesla parts. So hookup the trailer and drag it home!

[bmorgil]

A few parts in there both you boy's! 56' right off the bat "I spy" an original oil filter canister.

[gmwillys]

It definitely helps to pick up parts donors.

[56willys]

A few parts in there both you boy's! 56' right off the bat "I spy" an original oil filter canister. Yep, I already have the filter removed and cleaned up. Just needs a quick paint and it will be brand new. Pretty much everything in the drivetrain is reusable. I wanted to get it for all the pasts that aren't remanufactured. It also has a Dana 27. I might look into swapping in flossy since it has a 25. But that won't be for awhile.


Gm, that 46 looks so cool sitting there! Always liked the half cabs.

[gmwillys]

That 47 was completely trashed. The middle section of the frame was rotten. I salvaged the front frame rails and welded them in to our Heep, plus a plethora of good parts, the best being the grill bullet marker lights.

[bmorgil]

I think you posted that frame graft gm!

Having a complete drive train that is original is a major part of the game 56'. Those pieces will always be "gold". If your going to play with classic Jeeps, you cant have too many spare parts!

The only real advantage the Model 27 offers is the availability of gear ratios. The 25 only has 1 ratio. The 27 had several available. This is only an advantage in Jeep CJ's from mid 1950 on, when the Model 44 became standard in the rear. The Model 41 axle that was in the Willys had only one ratio also. Therefor if you don't have a 44 rear the 27 really offers no advantage. From a pure strength stand point, the 25 is actually stronger, no matter what you read. It has a larger diameter ring gear and more bolts attaching the ring gear. The ring gear is thinner. Some might mistake that for less strength. It makes no difference however. Ring gears vary in thickness based on the ratio due to Pinion to Ring center lines. A 3.08 ratio gear is much thinner than a 3.73 ratio because the pinion diameter gets smaller in the 3.73 ratio. The strength however is the same.

[gmwillys]

I wish I did get photos of the front frame graph on the Heep. It would have been good content, but that was long before I knew that there was a forum to share on. The first two photos are the before with the scabbed together frame horns.

[Catlewis]

Finally installed the old windshield in the new frame. Only took about half gallon (sarcastic) of liquid soap! Far more difficult than I anticipated. Other than that, the frame itself fits great.
11499

[Catlewis]

Picked up seats from Upholstery shop over the weekend. Turned out great.
1150011500

[test1328]

Those seats look really nice, Cat! What kind of upholstery shop did you take it to? Just wondering since I need to do the same for mine. Did they specialize in car seats or something else?

[Catlewis]

Dressler's Upholstery. Private family owned business however they do top notch work! For example, they have done interiors for Jay Leno! This material is what they suggested when I requested "Leather". I'm not certain on the correctly spelling however it's something like "Allante" leather. According to them, it looks and feels just like leather but out lasts it ten times over and requires zero maintenance. I also had a crew cab F350 done in the same material couple years ago, still looks new. 11501

[bmorgil]

Nice Cat! I like the upholstery job. The windshield gasket can give you blisters that's for sure.

[56willys]

Gosh that thing is looking pretty! That seat looks amazing, I always liked the split benches. Not to mention it's Jay Leno approved, that's some bragging rights there! I know there's a dresslers upholstery in central PA near beaver springs. If that's the place, i am a frequent attendee at the dragstrip in Beaver springs.

[gmwillys]

Spectacular work there. I can see why Jay Leno had them do work for him.

[Catlewis]

@56willys, Yes that's the shop here in central PA. As for Beaver Springs Dragway,,,,,,,35 years ago I worked there several seasons as a 2nd job to earn a few extra bucks when my wife and I first married. It's a fact Dressler's do fine work and they attach an appropriate price tag to it, therefore if you plan on having them do any work, make certain your wallet has an elastic waistband! I think there may have been a Jay Leno royalty fee attached to my invoice......... Those two little seats,,,,,, $954.00!

[bmorgil]

Not a bad price for a good upholstery job. It is getting Very difficult to find upholstery shops anymore, let alone those that are craftsman.

Working at the Dragway..... Awesome way to spend the day man! Ah the smell of smokin' tires and burning Methanol in the morning!

[Catlewis]

Sunday was the main "Drag day" and I along with another "rookie" worked the burn-out boxes + scanned for vehicles leaking anything. Later I took on an additional role as the "starter" (controlled the starting lights / christmas tree) for the Friday and Saturday night grudge races. These were non-points events, reduced gate fees, and often used for test & tune + the local street racers often participated. Top prize was a small trophy and a free Pizza from local restaurant.

[LarrBeard]

"Those two little seats,,,,,, $954.00!"


I heard an ad for woodworking tools last week that said "Pay once, cry once"; the point being pay for good work once, cry about it but you don't have to do it again.

[56willys]

@56willys, Yes that's the shop here in central PA. As for Beaver Springs Dragway,,,,,,,35 years ago I worked there several seasons as a 2nd job to earn a few extra bucks when my wife and I first married. It's a fact Dressler's do fine work and they attach an appropriate price tag to it, therefore if you plan on having them do any work, make certain your wallet has an elastic waistband! I think there may have been a Jay Leno royalty fee attached to my invoice......... Those two little seats,,,,,, $954.00!

Awesome! That's really neat that you worked there. I get to attend about three events a year with the one gentleman I work for. It's a really cool facility and the crew is super nice. (I wasn't there when you worked, but I'm sure the employees were just as cool!!) Maybe one of these day my CJ5 will make a test pass at Beaver Springs. I could probably pull of a blistering 30 seconds at 60mph haha!!

That price honestly seems fair. With the prices on everything these days and imported stuff. It's nice to get a good quality job that was done local that will last forever and looks amazing!

[bmorgil]

Running the drag strip with your vintage Jeep is an easy pass. Put your flags all on, turn on your lights and roll up to the start line. No burn out. Stage, and gently engage the clutch at the green light. Roll gently through the gate and shift easy at low RPM. Honk and wave at the crowd. Do not exceed 2500 RPM at any time. When the light comes on at the top of the track, honk some more. That should be a great run! Return to your pit and enjoy the lookers.

[LarrBeard]

And for the whole 45-seconds it takes to make your pass, the crowd will be going wild over a Jeep!

[gmwillys]

You'd get way more thumbs up in the Jeep then Jungle Pam on the staging lane.

[Catlewis]

Looking for a little help. On-line research has (so far) turned up nothing for a 1965 CJ5 headlight switch wiring diagram. Anyone have one to share? I'm replacing the switch and found a wire that likely came off the switch however no way of knowing which lug it goes to. Therefore a schematic with color codes for each wire will be necessary. Thanks!

[bmorgil]

The 65' seems to be vague to say the least! I couldn't find anything much better than the repro service manual (which was reprinted in 1965). It is the schematic pictured in this eWillys link below. You may have to "reverse engineer" the switch circuit with an Multi-Meter.

http://www.ewillys.com/2013/01/01/wiring-schematics/

[Catlewis]

Yeah, really hoping to find one with color codes. Research seems to indicate this switch was used from 46 thru 71, however I'm guessing color codes likely changed / evolved over the years therefore likely need one for 65 year specific for reliable accuracy on the colors. Wire in question is a light blue wire hanging loose under dash and the way it's "bent" makes it appear it originally attached to headlight switch??? Also another somewhat related question, what's the most popular method to add a brake light switch on Jeeps when you upgrade to the dual master cylinder?

[bmorgil]

The color of the wires started out white and black, and that's it! There weren't a lot of circuit's in the 40's. A reprint of the actual 1965 manual might have something better with the 65' color code. Those are hard to find.

The best way to set up the brake light is to utilize a pressure switch just like the original setup.

[Catlewis]

I already bought one of the mechanical / universal type switches with the arm. Not much info provided with it, I'm not even certain if it's a switch suitable for exterior use or is it designed to be mounted inside /interior?

[bmorgil]

I would return the mechanical switch. The hydraulic activation is so simple, it takes all the work out of it. Just install the pressure switch in the system right at or anywhere inline with the master cylinder, and wire it up. There are no brackets to mount or arms to adjust. This one is listed for the early Jeeps but it works on any system. Any of the pressure switches KW sells will work. I would only use the mechanical set up if the vehicle had one originally.

https://www.kaiserwillys.com/products/brake-light-switch-fits-41-45-mb-gpw/

[gmwillys]

I second Bmorgil's advice on returning the mechanical switch. A simple but not cheap solution for the brake switch for a dual pot reservoir is to put in this proportioning valve with a hydraulic brake switch plumbed in.

https://www.kaiserwillys.com/products/master-cylinder-proportioning-distribution-valve-kit-fits-66-71-cj-5-jeepster-commando/

The valve has two inlets and two outlets for the dual reservoir, but you can adjust the brake bias from front to rear. The downside would be that the valve would need to be mounted near the reservoir, so it would not be accessible while driving. A cheaper way to go would be to plumb in a T to adapt the switch in line with the brake line,

https://www.kaiserwillys.com/products/brake-hose-tee-fitting-3-port-fits-66-73-jeepster-commando/
https://www.kaiserwillys.com/products/brake-light-switch-fits-46-66-jeep-willys/

[bmorgil]

Here is another source for the Tee in case it is 1/4" brake fittings. It should be 3/16" originally as gm indicated. You could install one of these anywhere in the brake line, preferably near the master cylinder and in the front line out. Since you don't have a front disc rear drum combination you don't need a proportioning valve, but as gm is saying they sure do make fine tuning the brakes easy. You are looking for a 652x4 for 1/4" and 652x3 for 3/16" and 652x6 for 3/8". There are a few places to get them including the local auto parts store.

https://www.applied.com/c-brands/c-danfoss-fluid-power/c-weatherhead-by-danfoss/652x4/Inverted-Flare-Brass-Fitting/p/105264402

[Catlewis]

Thanks for info gentlemen!

[Catlewis]

Well, I decided to keep the mechanical switch and actually came up with a very easy way to install. I bought a two wire weatherpack pigtail, soldered wires + used waterproof heat shrink at both splice joints to Jeep wiring harness & mechanical switch. The weatherpack connector allows for the switch to be easily replaced in the future in the event of failure or normal service life. I mounted the switch to the underside of the access panel for the brake master and made the wires long enough allowing the panel to be removed and set aside without disconnecting wires. Really worked out to be a clean install + it's serviceable. Should've taken a few pics........

[gmwillys]

You'll have to throw in some photos for those interested in trying your set up.

[Catlewis]

Snapped a couple pics of the jeep last evening. Still need to build a front bumper & rear spare tire carrier. Hardtop needs the most attention now. Both doors need disassembled and sorted out. Windows do not roll down + handles need to be replaced allowing me to lock doors. Other than that, it seems to run great. It's about a 35mph vehicle!

1175211753

[gmwillys]

Looking great Catlewis. What are your plans for a front bumper and rear spare tire carrier?

[Catlewis]

I'll probably reinstall the original Tux chrome bumpers first, however eventually plan to weld up a heavy duty front bumper that incorporates a winch. Finished plans for the rear will require removing the Tux bumper and welding up a 2X4 Steel tube bumper that incorporates a tire carrier. Likely start out with an EMS Offroad Tire Carrier Kit that allows the spare to hinge away from the tailgate and rear hatch. Might add in a high lift jack??? Repairs to the hardtop are next on the list. Hoping to have time to work that in before hunting season this fall. Been driving the Jeep around a little lately, it's definitely not a highway vehicle. 35mph seems to be near my comfort level.

[bmorgil]

35 MPH is a great speed for the old CJ's. Mine likes 35 to 40. Nice speed to see the world!

[56willys]

That's a good looking tuxedo park there, Cat. I love the red with white top, it has a great vintage appeal to it.


35 MPH is a great speed for the old CJ's. Mine likes 35 to 40. Nice speed to see the world!

Flossy will handle 50 no problem with minimal effort. But man, cruising the dirtroads at 30 is where the real fun is. The other night about 11 o'clock it was beautiful weather and tons of stars out, so I drove Flossy around a little. Barely went above 20 and it was probably the coolest ride ever! Below 35 is perfect to just relax and enjoy the beauty of old Jeeps, and the little hurricane is still quiet enough to have a conversation!

[LarrBeard]

We ended up on a cruise in the '48 last Saturday - I was about a third of the way back in the queue, and at one turn in the road the front of the pack missed a turn. My navigator (my wife) said "Turn left here" and I did. Pretty soon I found myself in the lead of what was left of the parade - at my sedate 40 MPH. The truck just puttered along; 33PSI on the oil gauge, 165 on temperature an about 5 amps float charge.

It was about 20 minutes to the next stop and on the way several guys came by me at 60+ MPH. At the next stop one of the guys (in a Corvette) came by and apologized for passing, but he said he was about to boil over and he had to get some air moving.

Old Jeeps like 40 MPH.

Photo Captions: This is what a Happy Truck looks like at 40 MPH

"This was my GrandPa's truck" but he "fixed" it up. A matter of opinion - it's just Jeep parts on another chassis.

And, here is a real Jeep truck; "Ham's '48"

[bmorgil]

The 48' looks and runs like it just came out of dealer prep for delivery in 1948. Nice time machine Larry!

[gmwillys]

Ham's is a tremendously accurate example of how the Jeep trucks were from the factory. Even the snooty Corvette guys know they can't compete.

[Catlewis]

Looks better with the original factory chrome bumper. It's a little bent, and the chrome isn't even close to "show quality", but better than nothing. Also have the original chrome rear bumper. May also install it temporarily. New replacement bumper is ridiculously priced @$500.00.
11757

[gmwillys]

I agree that the chrome bumpers look good on it but won't disagree that some custom bumpers would also look good as well. The price commanded by some of these more reputable companies is jumping up by the day. I've been searching for a functional winch mount/bumper for our YJ, but the prices are outside of my budget. The price of metal to build one from scratch is outrageous too.

[bmorgil]

Catlewis have you looked into a good re-chromer? These guy's are probably one of the best. https://www.tricityplating.com/ I have no idea of the cost. Google Bumper "Re-chroming and Straightening".

You may have one close. Some small shops still have the equipment. I used to get this done quite inexpensively back in the day before the EPA got powerful. These shops are still around, but you have to look. If you have a good contact in Mexico, they definitely get it done there, but you ave to know the shop or the quality may be bad.

[LarrBeard]

When we restored the '48, the front bumper had a bend in it from the time that one of the mothers bounced Dad's truck off of a pine tree at a scout camp out in about 1957 or 1958. (Dad was cooking catfish and he asked here to go get some more and a pine tree jumped out into her way).

But, as we put the truck back together, we decided that the bent bumper would be out of place, even if it added character. We did find a good re-chromer and when we got it back, it looked better than it did in 1948. It was straight and the only sign of it being straightened are a couple of marks on the back where they used blocks as supports to bend it back into shape.

It was well worth the money.

[Catlewis]

Work continues on the old Jeep,,,,,,,,,,The Kelly hardtop is in need of total disassembly for proper repairs to be made. Unfortunately I simply don't have enough spare time for this right now, AND want to use the Jeep through the winter for hunting season and as a "going to camp rig". Therefore I'm compromising and limiting repairs to attain functionality only, visual appearance concerns will have to wait until another time. With that said, the doors are biggest issue as neither window rolls up or down. In fact the passenger side glass is no longer attached to the regulator. Both door handles are terrible worn and no key to lock them. I purchased two new stainless steel lockable handles however the bolt pattern was different therefore requiring welding the existing assembly holes shut and redrilling new pattern. Long story short, new handles installed and windows repaired. Glued the passenger side glass back in place and the chain style regulators were cleaned and lubricated to restore functionality. The top isn't pretty, but it will do for now. Also important to pass along. While researching these hardtop wind components, they're obviously obsolete now, however I found that new chain style regulators were also used on commercial trucks (Kenworth), and they very likely could be retro fitted to these doors. 118071180811809

[gmwillys]

There are a few options for the window regulators, with the closest being the manual KW regulators. Even the newer bicycle chain styles being an option. You'd have to verify the length of the mechanism to ensure that they are not too long for the door of your hardtop, but even then, you could modify by cutting down a set to work .

https://dirksclassictruck.com/product/dirks1799-kenworth-manual-window-regulator-lh/

[Catlewis]

This is a Kelly hardtop and the chain regulators have plastic / nylon sprockets for the twisted link chain. The driver door has at least one tooth broken off the lower sprocket, yet still functional. Future plans include replacing the entire assemblies. Thinking the regulators with roller chain similar in size to bicycle chain would provide smoother operation and likely last longer, therefore I'm leaning that direction. The original regulators were manufactured by AI Hansen MFG Co. Gurnee ILL. and measure 21". I could not find any regulators on kw site. 1181511816

[test1328]

Hey Cat,
I've got a similar Kelly hard top and haven't quite gotten to the point of actively working on it, but I've been thinking about it some and doing some investigation. I know you've apparently fixed your door handle problem, but I was recently investigating the same thing and much to my surprise, I found basically the same handles that my hard top has on it on Amazon. Of course, I have no idea if the hole patterns are the same, but they look identical except for the nylon striker plates. The handles are listed from a company called Vintage Technologies for RVs and they had a lot of different handles, locks, etc. You might find something similar by looking that up. Here is the link to my handles: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01347C5C6/ref=ox_sc_saved_image_1?smid=A2XNAWTFQID8GX&psc=1

With regard to the window regulators that you're working on, one thing that came to my mind on how you might be able to come up with something similar to what you have there would be to use the plastic chain and sprockets that you can buy from McMaster Carr. I've used them over the years on various work projects in the R&D field to accomplish all kinds of things where you need custom belts and gearing for light working mechanisms. You can basically make a bicycle chain any length you want and you can buy different diameter sprockets to get the gearing you need or want. Here's a link to what I'm talking about: https://www.mcmaster.com/products/chain-sprockets/?s=plastic+chain+sprockets

Hopefully, that helps a bit. I'm very interested in what you're doing since a lot of it will apply directly to what I'll eventually need to do myself.

[gmwillys]

I goofed in saying KW when I was referring to Kenworth, especially on the Kaiser Willys forum. The link below has the Kenworth bicycle chain regulator. The bicycle chain version is linked below. I do like Test1328's idea of converting your existing set up through McMaster-Carr. You should be able to convert yours to a roller chain sprocket with a little checking.

https://www.4statetrucks.com/window-regulator-replaces-k092-189-k092-189r-ppr_204200?srsltid=AfmBOorm1czBJ8-fqgnOFXQypM4-OCp3XVdRCx0ylIeY3por5Ovffaho

[Catlewis]

Great info guys!
Never considered retrofitting existing regulators / updating to roller chain sprockets,,,,,,,,,now that makes perfect sense and far less expensive.
TEST1328: Wish I had known of the handle / lock set you found. That's nearly identical to what mine came with originally. I'll file the info for future reference. Thanks!

[Catlewis]

Also, just to confirm, my top also has those nylon strikers. The set you found would've worked perfectly for me.

[bmorgil]

You are going to love that top when you get it working. If you are actually using it as a Jeep, you cant beat having a top in the rain and/or cold.

[Catlewis]

Another thing I discovered (possibly everyone but me already knows), when mounting the top and fitting doors, it worked best for me to attach the top to the windshield frame first, then mount the doors, and adjust the side panels to match the doors. Doing this I quickly realized passenger door was bent "in" at the bottom.
Yes, I like the hardtop and happy that it's finally functional. Correcting all of the rust holes, and cosmetic issues is going to be a major project. Maybe next winter (2025)??? Already have another project slated for this winter.

[test1328]

Glad my suggestions might help you, Cat!

Yes, a hard top is incredibly valuable if you live in a climate that features rain and especially snow. Growing up and hunting in a town at an elevation over 10,000 ft. meant lots of cold, snowy days where the hardtop was really critical to not freezing to death. When my Dad bought his 83 CJ5, it came with a soft top and the first thing we did was start searching for a hard top for it. This was in 88 or 89 and most companies had quit making the hard tops for the CJ5 since they quit making the CJ5 in 83. It took me a few years and when I finally found one we jumped on it. I believe it is an ACME composite hard top and is still on the Jeep. I always hated those new hard tops since the windows in the doors no longer rolled down. They have a small window that slides side to side, so you only get about half the window open. Ventilation in the cab sucks when its a hot day, but when it's cold, that hard top sure is nice. It really made me appreciate that old Kelly Steel hard top with the roll down windows.

[gmwillys]

I have to agree with you on the sliding windows. I've been looking for a long time for an affordable yet not rotten to a pile International Scout 80. The first two model years had sliding windows instead of roll-up windows. The following years had roll up windows, and to me are much more desirable just for the reasons you stated. Our YJ Wrangler has the full soft top and doors, and the zip up windows are a pain, but used hard doors are outrageous in price, plus the soft top for the soft doors will not fit the hard doors, so then you have to find or purchase a new top. For the short amount of time the top is needed in the South, I'll just put up with the zip up windows until a good deal comes around.

[Catlewis]

Ironically, my first 4x4 was an 1968 International Scout! Wrenched on that thing for my first few years, made my own "Spring over axle" lift kit. Even located and purchased one of the rare Fiberglass Sport tops for it. Rolled it over one snowy morning driving to work, that was around 1985. Window regulators were also an issue on those vehicles. Seem to remember the steering was incredible slow & sloppy too. Fun little 4x4 ALL WHEEL DRIVE!

[gmwillys]

My Great Uncle had a mid-sixties Scout 80. It was a pile of rust, but it worked great around his spread. I spent many a summer day as a youngster riding with him checking fences. He had a creek that crossed his property, and we would ford across with water pouring through the rust holes. The only downside was that the mice started boiling out from under the seats to get away from the rising water. The Scout is still on the farm, but it was crushed by the barn when it fell in back in the '90s. I asked to cut it out, but the remaining family have plans to do something with it someday. Since then, nothing has moved according to Google maps.

[bmorgil]

gm you need to get a hold of tat Scout! Those mid 60's were cuties. I know you can restore it. $30K restored but, I bet it would go for way more at auction.

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1965-international-harvester-scout-80-21/

[gmwillys]

I would, but it's had a barn resting on top of it for so many years, plus it was roached out pretty bad before. The last conversation I had with my cousin he said that they were going to do something with it someday..... Just like they did with the pair of FJ40 Land cruisers that were run until destroyed. I'll be much better off to find one that is in one piece and re-build it from there. Much like a Willys, most all of the body panels are available and aren't terribly expensive. First, I need to get back on and finish the wagon project, then worry about the starting something else. I've been eyeing some mid 2000's Chevy Tahoe's that are going pretty cheap for drive train donors. If I find one, then I'll need to let the LS master in Bmorgil go through it when I get enough spare funds.

[Catlewis]

Up here in the rust belt, chevy pick-ups are a great resource for LS engines / drivetrain. They had a real issue with their frames rotting out.

[gmwillys]

True, the rust belt will offer more of a selection of options. I'll probably stick with my local selections for rust free candidates. They are mostly roached out for body damage and crappy interiors, but if I choose to utilize the frame/drivetrain, then I would like to have good metal to start with. I wouldn't do a complete frame swap, but rather use some of the steel from the donor frame to box or stiffen the Willys frame. Yes, I could use nice virgin steel, but what's the challenge in that?

[bmorgil]

.......Yes, I could use nice virgin steel, but what's the challenge in that?

Hahaha! Definitely not your M O gm. We can set you up in an LS that's for sure.

[gmwillys]

On marketplace last night there was a running and driving '04 Tahoe with less than 150,000 miles on the clock that was rolled on its side for $1,000. The only drawback was that it was 2 WD. The deals are out there, just have to find the right one. There is a fine line between taking on a challenge and just being cheap.

[LarrBeard]

"We can set you up in an LS that's for sure."

Is that one still sitting by your back door?

[Catlewis]

I realize this isn't the norm, however last fall my neighbor was selling his 2006 Chevy Silverado (which he purchased new, so this is a one owner truck) after it failed state inspection due to severely rusted frame. He asked if I was interested and at the time, "no". However recognizing it as a screaming deal, said "while I'm not interested, I'm certain a friend of mine will be". And without seeing the truck he was willing to pay $700 for a 2006 4x4 extended cab 5.3 automatic that runs and drives 88,000 miles.......... Have you ever passed up an opportunity in life and then wished you could have a "do over"? Yup, this is one for me......... I still don't have a need for this, however it was a missed opportunity for sure.

[gmwillys]

That's my problem, the rust ranch has been full of good deals that I didn't pass up. Usually, I'll find a home for it later on or scrap it if the value is greater than the salvage metal or resale worth is of the pile. At one time I had five Jeeps and a M151A2 MUTT with three being M38A1s that were utilized to build one, and one that was too good to cut up. Currently, I have the long-suffering wagon project that is patiently awaiting its turn again, and a crusty Craigslist Ford industrial loader tractor that hasn't made its way inside yet to troubleshoot to see if the engine is really stuck or not. Other than that, the inventory is pretty well cleaned out.

[bmorgil]

"We can set you up in an LS that's for sure."

Is that one still sitting by your back door?

That ones long gone in a truck somewhere, shipped out a nice blown stroker that was well over 800hp just last month. It was put into a Cadillac! I have one going together right now that is designed for ethanol. It should be about 650hp naturally aspirated. That would be a good one for gm! It should idle around 1000 rpm, and shake the kitchen windows.

[gmwillys]

That is what I need! A kitchen window shaker is definitely in the cards.