My first vehicle! 1956 CJ5

[gmwillys]

'56, Not all hope is lost, don't you worry!

A quick and dirty way to magically fix a carburetor is to run the engine at high idle while standing close to the carb. Cup your hand over the throat of the carb until it nearly snuffs out, then repeat a couple of times. This will create a huge amount of vacuum within the carb and can help to blow out any restrictions that may have been missed on your rebuilt carb. The carb you are running may be a timing issue more than a fuel issue from what I'm hearing. Bmorgil is the master tuner, so he will have some good ideas to try. Carb tuning is a science and an art all wrapped up in one.

[bmorgil]

56', when they wont idle unless the choke is on it is a sure sign the idle circuit in the carburetor is blocked. Try gm's trick and see if it clears out.

https://willysjeepforum.kaiserwillys...highlight=idle

https://willysjeepforum.kaiserwillys...highlight=idle

The metering rod controls the mid range so to speak. The intermediate circuit. The idle needs to be corrected first. The throttle plate needs to be almost fully closed so the transition slot can function correctly. If the idle mixture screw does nothing, something has to be done to correct that first. The engine should idle with just one or two turns of the idle speed screw. Then the idle mixture screw should have an effect as you turn it in and out. Put the metering rod back where it was. It needs to start lifting when the throttle plate clears the transition slot in the carb throat. See if you can get the idle right and then we can go from there.

Now the old carb. It sounds like it needs fuel in the beginning of the cruise circuit. The transition and intermediate fuel is coming into play here. Give it a little more idle mixture. Turn the mixture screw one turn out and try it. It sounds like when vacuum is high during very low load and above idle RPM it is going lean. If it doesn't respond to this or it helps just a little, adjust the metering rod so it lifts a little higher when the carb throttle blade is in the area where it seems to be miss firing. Remember a miss fire as it relates to fuel mixture is almost always a lean condition. Rich smokes and smells, lean pops and miss fires.

[Catlewis]

Had mine rebuilt. It wasn't cheap however it idles like a champ!

jeep11.jpgjeep12.jpgjeep13.jpg

[AJ-MJ]

I Recently sent my carburetor off to Rick at "Old Jeep Carbs LLC" based on recommendations from experienced members. Today, Rick & I had a long conversation reviewing the estimate to rebuild my carb. He mic'ed the throttle bore and shaft. Both of these dimensions were out of tolerance. Per Rick that will cause a vacuum leak. He has a great website to search/educate and I would suggest calling him and discuss your issue and potential having him rebuild your carburetor. Rick also suggested when I get my carb back and start the engine, to time the engine without a timing light by using a vacuum gauge. Rick said he has a video of how to do it. I have not watched the video yet so I cannot comment on it. AND NO IT ISN"T CHEAP! But I think the cost to professionally rebuild your carburetor is great value!

[bmorgil]

If you aren't comfortable rebuilding carburetors, the price is right and the guy has good recommendations it is definitely money well spent.

I would stick to his carburetor work and not the timing recommendation. There is only one correct way to time an engine, with a vacuum gauge is not it. I have heard so many different ways to screw up the timing I could write a book! Proper timing is established based on a lot of things. An engine dynamometer, even in the old days, was one of them. Once the Best timing numbers are established by the engine manufacturer or engine builder, you use the procedure that works best for you to set it to that number. No one knows where it will end up any other way. On the 134 it is easily done with an Ohm Meter or a light bulb.

When your hot rodding you can eek a little performance out of advancing the timing a small amount and using good fuel. Again this experiment is best done on a dynamometer. You will never feel the difference on the 60 HP 134.

[56willys]

First off, thank you all for the insights, everything is a huge help!

So with the old carb still on I gave the mixture screw a half a turn rich. And I fixed the vacuum leak, and oh my it liked that. I didn't go crazy driving, just a short leisurely trip but there was no breaking up, it ran nice and smooth and pulled up hills much better then before. I'm liking it. I want to do a little more testing, I think I have the mixture a little too rich now, so I'll fine tune that, but I would say it's dialed.

So know it's on to the rebuilt carb. One of theses days I'll put it back on and try gms trick to get the passageways cleared out. I thought for sure I got it cleaned well enough, but things happen. As for getting it done professionally that would be really nice, and I'd have a perfect carb, but I really enjoy learning things. And yeah I might spend tons of time failing but eventually I'll get the hang of it. And if I rebuild it, when something goes wrong I can fix it. Plus the bank account really likes to not spend extra money. So I'll keep tinkering away until I get it figure out.

I also got the shims from Herm for the overdrive so I started getting it put back together. Fingers crossed it works! Which in the midst of that, dummy me dropped a washer in the tcase, and I couldn't get it fished out with a magnet so I had to drop the t case oil pan. Which the good news is the insides literally look brand new. But there is a tiny bit of silver metal shavings in the oil. I don't know if it's from the overdrive when I screwd up before, or just from transmission grinding. There has been a couple gear clashes with rookies like me driving.

[gmwillys]

'56, the best way to learn is to do it wrong before you do it right.

Bmorgil is right on the money as usual. Engine dynos are amazing tools that very few people have access to. The TV shows like Engine Masters do not show all the time spent tuning the engines before really twisting the tail to see how many ponies are actively running. I typically do not use a timing light or vacuum gage to set timing unless it is an expensive, close tolerance race engine. I feel that I have a pretty good ear for low horse, run of the mill-mills.

[56willys]

I had set timing with vacuum a while ago, since flossy doesn't have any timing marks/pointer. But I still ear tuned a little, turn it this way see what it does, turn the other and see what happens. I know my friends over in the performance world don't like vacuum timing, but with a 134 I could care less about power. I have to say though now with the vacuum leak fixed it runs much much better. There is no more breakup it just holds steady rpm. So I guess the old carb as been good all along, but I still want to figure out the rebuilt one.

So I reinstalled the overdrive with the shims and correct synchro. Which the new trans tunnel didn't have enough clearance so I had to jack up the body alittle but it worked. I got it all installed, backed out the garage and went through the yard. I made it about ten feet and it popped out of gear. Same as it was before.

So talking with Herm, he said that the stick out is still not enough and I could put more shims in it, but he said to try it how it is so that's what I did. He also said that the shims I have should be plenty and that there's probably an issue with the trans output shaft. Which maybe is also the grinding noise on deceleration I mentioned a while back. So how can I tell if there is an issue? What should I look for?

So my plan is, I won't be doing any long trips yet and can get by without overdrive so I'll put the stock gear back in (again). And run it through the summer. Possibly look into having Herm rebuild the od. Then come winter pull the drivetrain, do the rear main seal in the engine, fix the issue with the trans output (if there is a problem) and do a good cleaning/re sealing of everything and be good to go. But I'll see what you guys think and try to figure something out.

[gmwillys]

You have a solid plan. Enjoy Flossy for the summer, then tackle the winter projects when it's not so nice to ride.

Tuning is a fine art mixed with a little luck and determination. No two engine are exactly alike, and you have to find the perfect combination to get everything just right. We like your spirit of not accepting defeat on the other carburetor, so stick with it. You'll get er dialed in!

[bmorgil]

The vacuum leak was a great find for you 56'. That will cause a lean condition every time.

It is a dangerous thing to set timing with any method other than something that is giving you a true mechanical reference to where you are actually timing the engine. The ignition of the air fuel mixture is a narrow window. The total timing at RPM, idle timing, load timing and no load timing are all in the equation. ALL spark fired engines have a mechanical reference to set the correct ignition timing to. On the 134's the flywheels are marked at the sight hole in the bell housing on the flywheel. The timing is set just like it was on a motorcycle with points. You put a 6 or 12 volt light bulb across the points. When the bulb lights the points are open. The mark on the flywheel will immediately tell you exactly where the timing is. It doesn't get any easier than that. That is always where you should start. If you wish to experiment, you can vary it around slightly from there, preferably with something other than "the seat of your pants", though I certainly have had to do this in a pinch. If you feel you have a good timing set by the seat of your pants, you need to check it against the mechanical indicators and see just where you are. Changing the timing more than 10 degrees from factory settings indicates you have ventured to far, you can bet you are doing no good. I could go on for a while about what actually dictates the right ignition timing curve. It is a science in itself. I am constantly learning more about it as advanced combustion chamber designs and camshafts, change the amount of timing required. We are now seeing timing requirements retarding as combustion efficiency goes up in the modern engines. It is very important to set the timing to, at or near the recommended settings on every engine you have. Everything from the plugs to the bearings will last longer.

Timing is a changing target. It needs to be lowest under load and highest when it is not under load. It also needs to have enough "lead" to make a good clean idle. The very best thing to do is align the engines timing marks and set the timing to the engine manufacturers specification unless you have changed the way the engine is built. On the engine dynamometers, I and many others who have tuned engines on a dyno will tell you, very often the timing doesn't need to move far from factory settings. One of the things you learn from the dyno early on is more isn't always better. Some engines (like the 134) for various reasons will take a lot of timing without detonation. It doesn't mean because they can take more timing they need more timing. Some will not. Many factors contribute to this. In any event what is found is that the engines will respond with more power to a point and then fall off or produce no more power after timing is advanced further. After that some engines will just flatten out on the power curve with no appreciable gains. More ignition timing than required is much worse than less. More than required is very hard on engines, and very inefficient. Do yourselves a favor guy's, do it by the book. There is really nothing a vacuum gauge can tell you about the correct timing. The highest vacuum reading is not what you are looking for. Advancing the timing on an unloaded engine will always result in higher vacuum numbers... to a point, then you will melt a piston or break one and maybe a few rings.

https://www.mikesxs.net/randakks-hon...AaAvdkEALw_wcB